What do these terms in Caesar's Gallic wars mean?












2















In his Comentarii de bello Gallico, Ceasar writes this on first page:




The Belgae rises from the extreme frontier of Gaul, extend to the lower part of the river Rhine; and look toward the north and the rising sun. Aquitania extends from the river Garonne to the Pyrenaean mountains and to that part of the ocean which is near Spain: it looks between the setting of the sun, and the north star.




How to interpret rising setting/rising sun and North star, they don't make sense as East/West and North ?



What does 'look towards' mean ?










share|improve this question




















  • 2





    I'm not sure what doesn't make sense. The region between the north star and the rising sun is "Northeast", the region between the north star and the setting sun is "Northwest". Can you explain your confusion?

    – Mark C. Wallace
    6 hours ago













  • Okay , i was thinking only in four directions

    – Shlok Vaibhav
    6 hours ago











  • Of course Caesar did not write this: some translator did. Maybe you should ask latin.stackexchange.com for help.

    – kimchi lover
    4 hours ago
















2















In his Comentarii de bello Gallico, Ceasar writes this on first page:




The Belgae rises from the extreme frontier of Gaul, extend to the lower part of the river Rhine; and look toward the north and the rising sun. Aquitania extends from the river Garonne to the Pyrenaean mountains and to that part of the ocean which is near Spain: it looks between the setting of the sun, and the north star.




How to interpret rising setting/rising sun and North star, they don't make sense as East/West and North ?



What does 'look towards' mean ?










share|improve this question




















  • 2





    I'm not sure what doesn't make sense. The region between the north star and the rising sun is "Northeast", the region between the north star and the setting sun is "Northwest". Can you explain your confusion?

    – Mark C. Wallace
    6 hours ago













  • Okay , i was thinking only in four directions

    – Shlok Vaibhav
    6 hours ago











  • Of course Caesar did not write this: some translator did. Maybe you should ask latin.stackexchange.com for help.

    – kimchi lover
    4 hours ago














2












2








2








In his Comentarii de bello Gallico, Ceasar writes this on first page:




The Belgae rises from the extreme frontier of Gaul, extend to the lower part of the river Rhine; and look toward the north and the rising sun. Aquitania extends from the river Garonne to the Pyrenaean mountains and to that part of the ocean which is near Spain: it looks between the setting of the sun, and the north star.




How to interpret rising setting/rising sun and North star, they don't make sense as East/West and North ?



What does 'look towards' mean ?










share|improve this question
















In his Comentarii de bello Gallico, Ceasar writes this on first page:




The Belgae rises from the extreme frontier of Gaul, extend to the lower part of the river Rhine; and look toward the north and the rising sun. Aquitania extends from the river Garonne to the Pyrenaean mountains and to that part of the ocean which is near Spain: it looks between the setting of the sun, and the north star.




How to interpret rising setting/rising sun and North star, they don't make sense as East/West and North ?



What does 'look towards' mean ?







roman-empire france julius-caesar latin-language






share|improve this question















share|improve this question













share|improve this question




share|improve this question








edited 6 hours ago







Shlok Vaibhav

















asked 6 hours ago









Shlok VaibhavShlok Vaibhav

838




838








  • 2





    I'm not sure what doesn't make sense. The region between the north star and the rising sun is "Northeast", the region between the north star and the setting sun is "Northwest". Can you explain your confusion?

    – Mark C. Wallace
    6 hours ago













  • Okay , i was thinking only in four directions

    – Shlok Vaibhav
    6 hours ago











  • Of course Caesar did not write this: some translator did. Maybe you should ask latin.stackexchange.com for help.

    – kimchi lover
    4 hours ago














  • 2





    I'm not sure what doesn't make sense. The region between the north star and the rising sun is "Northeast", the region between the north star and the setting sun is "Northwest". Can you explain your confusion?

    – Mark C. Wallace
    6 hours ago













  • Okay , i was thinking only in four directions

    – Shlok Vaibhav
    6 hours ago











  • Of course Caesar did not write this: some translator did. Maybe you should ask latin.stackexchange.com for help.

    – kimchi lover
    4 hours ago








2




2





I'm not sure what doesn't make sense. The region between the north star and the rising sun is "Northeast", the region between the north star and the setting sun is "Northwest". Can you explain your confusion?

– Mark C. Wallace
6 hours ago







I'm not sure what doesn't make sense. The region between the north star and the rising sun is "Northeast", the region between the north star and the setting sun is "Northwest". Can you explain your confusion?

– Mark C. Wallace
6 hours ago















Okay , i was thinking only in four directions

– Shlok Vaibhav
6 hours ago





Okay , i was thinking only in four directions

– Shlok Vaibhav
6 hours ago













Of course Caesar did not write this: some translator did. Maybe you should ask latin.stackexchange.com for help.

– kimchi lover
4 hours ago





Of course Caesar did not write this: some translator did. Maybe you should ask latin.stackexchange.com for help.

– kimchi lover
4 hours ago










1 Answer
1






active

oldest

votes


















9














It is, perhaps easier to understand when compared with a map:



Gaul in the time of Caesar




  • image source Wikimedia CC BY-SA 4.0




Now, Caesar's meaning should be a little more clear. When he says:




"The Belgae rises from the extreme frontier of Gaul, extend to the lower part of the river Rhine; and look toward the north and the rising sun"




We can see that the territory of the Belgae extends from the frontier of Gaul furthest from Rome to the River Rhine in the South, and has a third border running northeast ("to the north and the rising sun").



It may seem a little confusing because the territory of the Belgae was roughly triangular, and so had only three borders.





Similarly, the territory of Aquitania, which




"extends from the river Garonne to the Pyrenaean mountains and to that part of the ocean which is near Spain: it looks between the setting of the sun, and the north star."




is bordered by the River Garonne, the Pyrenees and the ocean, with the fourth (northern) border running north-west ("between the setting of the sun, and the north star").





More generally, East is where the Sun rises, West is where it sets, and the North Star is in the north. Points between those on the compass would be North-east ("between the north star and the rising sun"), and North-west ("between the setting of the sun, and the north star").





It's also worth noting that translation from Latin to English (or, more generally, between any two languages) involves the translator making choices and interpretations.



My Latin copy of De bello Gallico has the following (emphasis mine):




"Belgae ab extremis Galliae finibus oriuntur; pertinent ad inferiorem partem fluminis Rheni; spectant in septentrionem et orientem solem."




and




"Aquitania a Garumna flumine ad Pyrenaeos montes et ad eam partem Oceani, quae est ad Hispaniam, pertinet; spectat inter occasum solis et septentriones."




Now, I quite like the 'standard' translation you quoted (it has a nice, poetic, ring), but alternate translations are certainly possible. However, whatever precise translation is preferred, the meaning of the text appears clear, as I described above.






share|improve this answer


























  • Thanks, for aquitane I am still confused, suppose i am in aquitane, to my west is Bay of Biscay, to south are Pyrenees, to North and east are Garonne river, what remains for North-west ?

    – Shlok Vaibhav
    2 hours ago











  • @ShlokVaibhav Caesar is describing the borders of Aquitaine. The northern border ran from north to west (i.e. in a northwesterly direction - see the map in the answer). Beyond that was Gaul (or 'Celtic Gaul' on the map), distinct from Gallia Narbonensis ('Prov Romana' on the map) which was beyond the Garonne to the west.

    – sempaiscuba
    2 hours ago











  • Great answer, but I think it should read "ad eaM partem Oceani" and not "ad eaRN partem Oceani". Oh, and "fiumine" should be "flumine" in "a Garumna flumine".

    – Gregory Higley
    1 hour ago













  • @GregoryHigley Thank you. I've corrected them. The first was due to autocorrect, but the second was entirely down to me (big fingers, small screen/keyboard!).

    – sempaiscuba
    1 hour ago












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1 Answer
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1 Answer
1






active

oldest

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active

oldest

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active

oldest

votes









9














It is, perhaps easier to understand when compared with a map:



Gaul in the time of Caesar




  • image source Wikimedia CC BY-SA 4.0




Now, Caesar's meaning should be a little more clear. When he says:




"The Belgae rises from the extreme frontier of Gaul, extend to the lower part of the river Rhine; and look toward the north and the rising sun"




We can see that the territory of the Belgae extends from the frontier of Gaul furthest from Rome to the River Rhine in the South, and has a third border running northeast ("to the north and the rising sun").



It may seem a little confusing because the territory of the Belgae was roughly triangular, and so had only three borders.





Similarly, the territory of Aquitania, which




"extends from the river Garonne to the Pyrenaean mountains and to that part of the ocean which is near Spain: it looks between the setting of the sun, and the north star."




is bordered by the River Garonne, the Pyrenees and the ocean, with the fourth (northern) border running north-west ("between the setting of the sun, and the north star").





More generally, East is where the Sun rises, West is where it sets, and the North Star is in the north. Points between those on the compass would be North-east ("between the north star and the rising sun"), and North-west ("between the setting of the sun, and the north star").





It's also worth noting that translation from Latin to English (or, more generally, between any two languages) involves the translator making choices and interpretations.



My Latin copy of De bello Gallico has the following (emphasis mine):




"Belgae ab extremis Galliae finibus oriuntur; pertinent ad inferiorem partem fluminis Rheni; spectant in septentrionem et orientem solem."




and




"Aquitania a Garumna flumine ad Pyrenaeos montes et ad eam partem Oceani, quae est ad Hispaniam, pertinet; spectat inter occasum solis et septentriones."




Now, I quite like the 'standard' translation you quoted (it has a nice, poetic, ring), but alternate translations are certainly possible. However, whatever precise translation is preferred, the meaning of the text appears clear, as I described above.






share|improve this answer


























  • Thanks, for aquitane I am still confused, suppose i am in aquitane, to my west is Bay of Biscay, to south are Pyrenees, to North and east are Garonne river, what remains for North-west ?

    – Shlok Vaibhav
    2 hours ago











  • @ShlokVaibhav Caesar is describing the borders of Aquitaine. The northern border ran from north to west (i.e. in a northwesterly direction - see the map in the answer). Beyond that was Gaul (or 'Celtic Gaul' on the map), distinct from Gallia Narbonensis ('Prov Romana' on the map) which was beyond the Garonne to the west.

    – sempaiscuba
    2 hours ago











  • Great answer, but I think it should read "ad eaM partem Oceani" and not "ad eaRN partem Oceani". Oh, and "fiumine" should be "flumine" in "a Garumna flumine".

    – Gregory Higley
    1 hour ago













  • @GregoryHigley Thank you. I've corrected them. The first was due to autocorrect, but the second was entirely down to me (big fingers, small screen/keyboard!).

    – sempaiscuba
    1 hour ago
















9














It is, perhaps easier to understand when compared with a map:



Gaul in the time of Caesar




  • image source Wikimedia CC BY-SA 4.0




Now, Caesar's meaning should be a little more clear. When he says:




"The Belgae rises from the extreme frontier of Gaul, extend to the lower part of the river Rhine; and look toward the north and the rising sun"




We can see that the territory of the Belgae extends from the frontier of Gaul furthest from Rome to the River Rhine in the South, and has a third border running northeast ("to the north and the rising sun").



It may seem a little confusing because the territory of the Belgae was roughly triangular, and so had only three borders.





Similarly, the territory of Aquitania, which




"extends from the river Garonne to the Pyrenaean mountains and to that part of the ocean which is near Spain: it looks between the setting of the sun, and the north star."




is bordered by the River Garonne, the Pyrenees and the ocean, with the fourth (northern) border running north-west ("between the setting of the sun, and the north star").





More generally, East is where the Sun rises, West is where it sets, and the North Star is in the north. Points between those on the compass would be North-east ("between the north star and the rising sun"), and North-west ("between the setting of the sun, and the north star").





It's also worth noting that translation from Latin to English (or, more generally, between any two languages) involves the translator making choices and interpretations.



My Latin copy of De bello Gallico has the following (emphasis mine):




"Belgae ab extremis Galliae finibus oriuntur; pertinent ad inferiorem partem fluminis Rheni; spectant in septentrionem et orientem solem."




and




"Aquitania a Garumna flumine ad Pyrenaeos montes et ad eam partem Oceani, quae est ad Hispaniam, pertinet; spectat inter occasum solis et septentriones."




Now, I quite like the 'standard' translation you quoted (it has a nice, poetic, ring), but alternate translations are certainly possible. However, whatever precise translation is preferred, the meaning of the text appears clear, as I described above.






share|improve this answer


























  • Thanks, for aquitane I am still confused, suppose i am in aquitane, to my west is Bay of Biscay, to south are Pyrenees, to North and east are Garonne river, what remains for North-west ?

    – Shlok Vaibhav
    2 hours ago











  • @ShlokVaibhav Caesar is describing the borders of Aquitaine. The northern border ran from north to west (i.e. in a northwesterly direction - see the map in the answer). Beyond that was Gaul (or 'Celtic Gaul' on the map), distinct from Gallia Narbonensis ('Prov Romana' on the map) which was beyond the Garonne to the west.

    – sempaiscuba
    2 hours ago











  • Great answer, but I think it should read "ad eaM partem Oceani" and not "ad eaRN partem Oceani". Oh, and "fiumine" should be "flumine" in "a Garumna flumine".

    – Gregory Higley
    1 hour ago













  • @GregoryHigley Thank you. I've corrected them. The first was due to autocorrect, but the second was entirely down to me (big fingers, small screen/keyboard!).

    – sempaiscuba
    1 hour ago














9












9








9







It is, perhaps easier to understand when compared with a map:



Gaul in the time of Caesar




  • image source Wikimedia CC BY-SA 4.0




Now, Caesar's meaning should be a little more clear. When he says:




"The Belgae rises from the extreme frontier of Gaul, extend to the lower part of the river Rhine; and look toward the north and the rising sun"




We can see that the territory of the Belgae extends from the frontier of Gaul furthest from Rome to the River Rhine in the South, and has a third border running northeast ("to the north and the rising sun").



It may seem a little confusing because the territory of the Belgae was roughly triangular, and so had only three borders.





Similarly, the territory of Aquitania, which




"extends from the river Garonne to the Pyrenaean mountains and to that part of the ocean which is near Spain: it looks between the setting of the sun, and the north star."




is bordered by the River Garonne, the Pyrenees and the ocean, with the fourth (northern) border running north-west ("between the setting of the sun, and the north star").





More generally, East is where the Sun rises, West is where it sets, and the North Star is in the north. Points between those on the compass would be North-east ("between the north star and the rising sun"), and North-west ("between the setting of the sun, and the north star").





It's also worth noting that translation from Latin to English (or, more generally, between any two languages) involves the translator making choices and interpretations.



My Latin copy of De bello Gallico has the following (emphasis mine):




"Belgae ab extremis Galliae finibus oriuntur; pertinent ad inferiorem partem fluminis Rheni; spectant in septentrionem et orientem solem."




and




"Aquitania a Garumna flumine ad Pyrenaeos montes et ad eam partem Oceani, quae est ad Hispaniam, pertinet; spectat inter occasum solis et septentriones."




Now, I quite like the 'standard' translation you quoted (it has a nice, poetic, ring), but alternate translations are certainly possible. However, whatever precise translation is preferred, the meaning of the text appears clear, as I described above.






share|improve this answer















It is, perhaps easier to understand when compared with a map:



Gaul in the time of Caesar




  • image source Wikimedia CC BY-SA 4.0




Now, Caesar's meaning should be a little more clear. When he says:




"The Belgae rises from the extreme frontier of Gaul, extend to the lower part of the river Rhine; and look toward the north and the rising sun"




We can see that the territory of the Belgae extends from the frontier of Gaul furthest from Rome to the River Rhine in the South, and has a third border running northeast ("to the north and the rising sun").



It may seem a little confusing because the territory of the Belgae was roughly triangular, and so had only three borders.





Similarly, the territory of Aquitania, which




"extends from the river Garonne to the Pyrenaean mountains and to that part of the ocean which is near Spain: it looks between the setting of the sun, and the north star."




is bordered by the River Garonne, the Pyrenees and the ocean, with the fourth (northern) border running north-west ("between the setting of the sun, and the north star").





More generally, East is where the Sun rises, West is where it sets, and the North Star is in the north. Points between those on the compass would be North-east ("between the north star and the rising sun"), and North-west ("between the setting of the sun, and the north star").





It's also worth noting that translation from Latin to English (or, more generally, between any two languages) involves the translator making choices and interpretations.



My Latin copy of De bello Gallico has the following (emphasis mine):




"Belgae ab extremis Galliae finibus oriuntur; pertinent ad inferiorem partem fluminis Rheni; spectant in septentrionem et orientem solem."




and




"Aquitania a Garumna flumine ad Pyrenaeos montes et ad eam partem Oceani, quae est ad Hispaniam, pertinet; spectat inter occasum solis et septentriones."




Now, I quite like the 'standard' translation you quoted (it has a nice, poetic, ring), but alternate translations are certainly possible. However, whatever precise translation is preferred, the meaning of the text appears clear, as I described above.







share|improve this answer














share|improve this answer



share|improve this answer








edited 1 hour ago

























answered 6 hours ago









sempaiscubasempaiscuba

53.9k6186234




53.9k6186234













  • Thanks, for aquitane I am still confused, suppose i am in aquitane, to my west is Bay of Biscay, to south are Pyrenees, to North and east are Garonne river, what remains for North-west ?

    – Shlok Vaibhav
    2 hours ago











  • @ShlokVaibhav Caesar is describing the borders of Aquitaine. The northern border ran from north to west (i.e. in a northwesterly direction - see the map in the answer). Beyond that was Gaul (or 'Celtic Gaul' on the map), distinct from Gallia Narbonensis ('Prov Romana' on the map) which was beyond the Garonne to the west.

    – sempaiscuba
    2 hours ago











  • Great answer, but I think it should read "ad eaM partem Oceani" and not "ad eaRN partem Oceani". Oh, and "fiumine" should be "flumine" in "a Garumna flumine".

    – Gregory Higley
    1 hour ago













  • @GregoryHigley Thank you. I've corrected them. The first was due to autocorrect, but the second was entirely down to me (big fingers, small screen/keyboard!).

    – sempaiscuba
    1 hour ago



















  • Thanks, for aquitane I am still confused, suppose i am in aquitane, to my west is Bay of Biscay, to south are Pyrenees, to North and east are Garonne river, what remains for North-west ?

    – Shlok Vaibhav
    2 hours ago











  • @ShlokVaibhav Caesar is describing the borders of Aquitaine. The northern border ran from north to west (i.e. in a northwesterly direction - see the map in the answer). Beyond that was Gaul (or 'Celtic Gaul' on the map), distinct from Gallia Narbonensis ('Prov Romana' on the map) which was beyond the Garonne to the west.

    – sempaiscuba
    2 hours ago











  • Great answer, but I think it should read "ad eaM partem Oceani" and not "ad eaRN partem Oceani". Oh, and "fiumine" should be "flumine" in "a Garumna flumine".

    – Gregory Higley
    1 hour ago













  • @GregoryHigley Thank you. I've corrected them. The first was due to autocorrect, but the second was entirely down to me (big fingers, small screen/keyboard!).

    – sempaiscuba
    1 hour ago

















Thanks, for aquitane I am still confused, suppose i am in aquitane, to my west is Bay of Biscay, to south are Pyrenees, to North and east are Garonne river, what remains for North-west ?

– Shlok Vaibhav
2 hours ago





Thanks, for aquitane I am still confused, suppose i am in aquitane, to my west is Bay of Biscay, to south are Pyrenees, to North and east are Garonne river, what remains for North-west ?

– Shlok Vaibhav
2 hours ago













@ShlokVaibhav Caesar is describing the borders of Aquitaine. The northern border ran from north to west (i.e. in a northwesterly direction - see the map in the answer). Beyond that was Gaul (or 'Celtic Gaul' on the map), distinct from Gallia Narbonensis ('Prov Romana' on the map) which was beyond the Garonne to the west.

– sempaiscuba
2 hours ago





@ShlokVaibhav Caesar is describing the borders of Aquitaine. The northern border ran from north to west (i.e. in a northwesterly direction - see the map in the answer). Beyond that was Gaul (or 'Celtic Gaul' on the map), distinct from Gallia Narbonensis ('Prov Romana' on the map) which was beyond the Garonne to the west.

– sempaiscuba
2 hours ago













Great answer, but I think it should read "ad eaM partem Oceani" and not "ad eaRN partem Oceani". Oh, and "fiumine" should be "flumine" in "a Garumna flumine".

– Gregory Higley
1 hour ago







Great answer, but I think it should read "ad eaM partem Oceani" and not "ad eaRN partem Oceani". Oh, and "fiumine" should be "flumine" in "a Garumna flumine".

– Gregory Higley
1 hour ago















@GregoryHigley Thank you. I've corrected them. The first was due to autocorrect, but the second was entirely down to me (big fingers, small screen/keyboard!).

– sempaiscuba
1 hour ago





@GregoryHigley Thank you. I've corrected them. The first was due to autocorrect, but the second was entirely down to me (big fingers, small screen/keyboard!).

– sempaiscuba
1 hour ago


















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