Are turbopumps lubricated?
$begingroup$
It is easy to find data about rocket engine propellant, but quite difficult to ind information about other fluids used in rocket engine. For engine using a turbopump, this pump turns at quite high speed. Such a piece of mechanic should require lubrication in order to work for more than few seconds.
My question is: in engine using turbopumps (RD-107, RS-25, Vulcain,...) how are the turbopump and other moving parts lubricated? What kind of lubricant is used and how is it distributed to moving parts?
engines
edited 4 hours ago
called2voyage♦
17k772129
asked 4 hours ago
Manu HManu H
867622
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
It is easy to find data about rocket engine propellant, but quite difficult to ind information about other fluids used in rocket engine. For engine using a turbopump, this pump turns at quite high speed. Such a piece of mechanic should require lubrication in order to work for more than few seconds.
My question is: in engine using turbopumps (RD-107, RS-25, Vulcain,...) how are the turbopump and other moving parts lubricated? What kind of lubricant is used and how is it distributed to moving parts?
engines
edited 4 hours ago
called2voyage♦
17k772129
asked 4 hours ago
Manu HManu H
867622
$endgroup$
1
$begingroup$
The fluid pumped may be used as lubricant too. A hyrdrocarbon lubricant could not be used for a liquid oxygen pump.
$endgroup$
– Uwe
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yep, using the working fluid as the lubricant is pretty common.
$endgroup$
– Russell Borogove
3 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
It is easy to find data about rocket engine propellant, but quite difficult to ind information about other fluids used in rocket engine. For engine using a turbopump, this pump turns at quite high speed. Such a piece of mechanic should require lubrication in order to work for more than few seconds.
My question is: in engine using turbopumps (RD-107, RS-25, Vulcain,...) how are the turbopump and other moving parts lubricated? What kind of lubricant is used and how is it distributed to moving parts?
engines
edited 4 hours ago
called2voyage♦
17k772129
asked 4 hours ago
Manu HManu H
867622
$endgroup$
It is easy to find data about rocket engine propellant, but quite difficult to ind information about other fluids used in rocket engine. For engine using a turbopump, this pump turns at quite high speed. Such a piece of mechanic should require lubrication in order to work for more than few seconds.
My question is: in engine using turbopumps (RD-107, RS-25, Vulcain,...) how are the turbopump and other moving parts lubricated? What kind of lubricant is used and how is it distributed to moving parts?
engines
engines
edited 4 hours ago
called2voyage♦
17k772129
asked 4 hours ago
Manu HManu H
867622
edited 4 hours ago
called2voyage♦
17k772129
asked 4 hours ago
Manu HManu H
867622
edited 4 hours ago
called2voyage♦
17k772129
edited 4 hours ago
called2voyage♦
17k772129
edited 4 hours ago
called2voyage♦
17k772129
17k772129
asked 4 hours ago
Manu HManu H
867622
asked 4 hours ago
Manu HManu H
867622
asked 4 hours ago
Manu HManu H
867622
867622
1
$begingroup$
The fluid pumped may be used as lubricant too. A hyrdrocarbon lubricant could not be used for a liquid oxygen pump.
$endgroup$
– Uwe
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yep, using the working fluid as the lubricant is pretty common.
$endgroup$
– Russell Borogove
3 hours ago
add a comment |
1
$begingroup$
The fluid pumped may be used as lubricant too. A hyrdrocarbon lubricant could not be used for a liquid oxygen pump.
$endgroup$
– Uwe
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yep, using the working fluid as the lubricant is pretty common.
$endgroup$
– Russell Borogove
3 hours ago
1
1
$begingroup$
The fluid pumped may be used as lubricant too. A hyrdrocarbon lubricant could not be used for a liquid oxygen pump.
$endgroup$
– Uwe
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
The fluid pumped may be used as lubricant too. A hyrdrocarbon lubricant could not be used for a liquid oxygen pump.
$endgroup$
– Uwe
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yep, using the working fluid as the lubricant is pretty common.
$endgroup$
– Russell Borogove
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yep, using the working fluid as the lubricant is pretty common.
$endgroup$
– Russell Borogove
3 hours ago
add a comment |
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
The bearings in the SSME (RS-25) had/have no conventional lubrication as such. They were cooled by minute flows of their respective propellants.
Knowing that the bearings have no lubrication except from a minute
transfer film of the Polytetrafluoroethylene (PTFE) from the cages to
the balls, several attempts at improving the lubrication and lowering
the heat generation in the bearings was investigated.
Source: History of Space Shuttle Main Engine Turbopump Bearing Testing at the Marshall Space Flight Center
Also
HPOTP bearings deteriorate quickly for many reasons. The balls wear
the fastest of all the bearing components and, in the process, lose
their preload. Liquid oxygen is their only lubricant and a poor one
at that.
From here
(HPOTP is High Pressure Oxidizer Turbopump)
You can see the coolant passage in this cutaway drawing of the Low Pressure Fuel Turbopump from here.
Also see here for more on the High Pressure Fuel Turbopump and here for the High Pressure Oxidizer Turbopump.
answered 4 hours ago
Organic MarbleOrganic Marble
59.9k3165256
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Polytetrafluoroethylene is a plastic material, not a propellant. Unless they're burning plastic as fuel?
$endgroup$
– immibis
36 mins ago
$begingroup$
I am not sure what point you are trying to make. The quoted document is just saying that some of the PTFE is transferred from the bearing cages to the ball bearing and that this is the only substance actually acting as a lubricant. The bearings are cooled by propellant flow, oxygen for the oxygen pumps and hydrogen for the hydrogen pumps.
$endgroup$
– Organic Marble
35 mins ago
add a comment |
Your Answer
StackExchange.ifUsing("editor", function () {
return StackExchange.using("mathjaxEditing", function () {
StackExchange.MarkdownEditor.creationCallbacks.add(function (editor, postfix) {
StackExchange.mathjaxEditing.prepareWmdForMathJax(editor, postfix, [["$", "$"], ["\\(","\\)"]]);
});
});
}, "mathjax-editing");
StackExchange.ready(function() {
var channelOptions = {
tags: "".split(" "),
id: "508"
};
initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);
StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function() {
// Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled) {
StackExchange.using("snippets", function() {
createEditor();
});
}
else {
createEditor();
}
});
function createEditor() {
StackExchange.prepareEditor({
heartbeatType: 'answer',
autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
convertImagesToLinks: false,
noModals: true,
showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
reputationToPostImages: null,
bindNavPrevention: true,
postfix: "",
imageUploader: {
brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
allowUrls: true
},
noCode: true, onDemand: true,
discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
});
}
});
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fspace.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f35460%2fare-turbopumps-lubricated%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
The bearings in the SSME (RS-25) had/have no conventional lubrication as such. They were cooled by minute flows of their respective propellants.
Knowing that the bearings have no lubrication except from a minute
transfer film of the Polytetrafluoroethylene (PTFE) from the cages to
the balls, several attempts at improving the lubrication and lowering
the heat generation in the bearings was investigated.
Source: History of Space Shuttle Main Engine Turbopump Bearing Testing at the Marshall Space Flight Center
Also
HPOTP bearings deteriorate quickly for many reasons. The balls wear
the fastest of all the bearing components and, in the process, lose
their preload. Liquid oxygen is their only lubricant and a poor one
at that.
From here
(HPOTP is High Pressure Oxidizer Turbopump)
You can see the coolant passage in this cutaway drawing of the Low Pressure Fuel Turbopump from here.
Also see here for more on the High Pressure Fuel Turbopump and here for the High Pressure Oxidizer Turbopump.
answered 4 hours ago
Organic MarbleOrganic Marble
59.9k3165256
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Polytetrafluoroethylene is a plastic material, not a propellant. Unless they're burning plastic as fuel?
$endgroup$
– immibis
36 mins ago
$begingroup$
I am not sure what point you are trying to make. The quoted document is just saying that some of the PTFE is transferred from the bearing cages to the ball bearing and that this is the only substance actually acting as a lubricant. The bearings are cooled by propellant flow, oxygen for the oxygen pumps and hydrogen for the hydrogen pumps.
$endgroup$
– Organic Marble
35 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The bearings in the SSME (RS-25) had/have no conventional lubrication as such. They were cooled by minute flows of their respective propellants.
Knowing that the bearings have no lubrication except from a minute
transfer film of the Polytetrafluoroethylene (PTFE) from the cages to
the balls, several attempts at improving the lubrication and lowering
the heat generation in the bearings was investigated.
Source: History of Space Shuttle Main Engine Turbopump Bearing Testing at the Marshall Space Flight Center
Also
HPOTP bearings deteriorate quickly for many reasons. The balls wear
the fastest of all the bearing components and, in the process, lose
their preload. Liquid oxygen is their only lubricant and a poor one
at that.
From here
(HPOTP is High Pressure Oxidizer Turbopump)
You can see the coolant passage in this cutaway drawing of the Low Pressure Fuel Turbopump from here.
Also see here for more on the High Pressure Fuel Turbopump and here for the High Pressure Oxidizer Turbopump.
answered 4 hours ago
Organic MarbleOrganic Marble
59.9k3165256
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Polytetrafluoroethylene is a plastic material, not a propellant. Unless they're burning plastic as fuel?
$endgroup$
– immibis
36 mins ago
$begingroup$
I am not sure what point you are trying to make. The quoted document is just saying that some of the PTFE is transferred from the bearing cages to the ball bearing and that this is the only substance actually acting as a lubricant. The bearings are cooled by propellant flow, oxygen for the oxygen pumps and hydrogen for the hydrogen pumps.
$endgroup$
– Organic Marble
35 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The bearings in the SSME (RS-25) had/have no conventional lubrication as such. They were cooled by minute flows of their respective propellants.
Knowing that the bearings have no lubrication except from a minute
transfer film of the Polytetrafluoroethylene (PTFE) from the cages to
the balls, several attempts at improving the lubrication and lowering
the heat generation in the bearings was investigated.
Source: History of Space Shuttle Main Engine Turbopump Bearing Testing at the Marshall Space Flight Center
Also
HPOTP bearings deteriorate quickly for many reasons. The balls wear
the fastest of all the bearing components and, in the process, lose
their preload. Liquid oxygen is their only lubricant and a poor one
at that.
From here
(HPOTP is High Pressure Oxidizer Turbopump)
You can see the coolant passage in this cutaway drawing of the Low Pressure Fuel Turbopump from here.
Also see here for more on the High Pressure Fuel Turbopump and here for the High Pressure Oxidizer Turbopump.
answered 4 hours ago
Organic MarbleOrganic Marble
59.9k3165256
$endgroup$
The bearings in the SSME (RS-25) had/have no conventional lubrication as such. They were cooled by minute flows of their respective propellants.
Knowing that the bearings have no lubrication except from a minute
transfer film of the Polytetrafluoroethylene (PTFE) from the cages to
the balls, several attempts at improving the lubrication and lowering
the heat generation in the bearings was investigated.
Source: History of Space Shuttle Main Engine Turbopump Bearing Testing at the Marshall Space Flight Center
Also
HPOTP bearings deteriorate quickly for many reasons. The balls wear
the fastest of all the bearing components and, in the process, lose
their preload. Liquid oxygen is their only lubricant and a poor one
at that.
From here
(HPOTP is High Pressure Oxidizer Turbopump)
You can see the coolant passage in this cutaway drawing of the Low Pressure Fuel Turbopump from here.
Also see here for more on the High Pressure Fuel Turbopump and here for the High Pressure Oxidizer Turbopump.
answered 4 hours ago
Organic MarbleOrganic Marble
59.9k3165256
edited 4 hours ago
answered 4 hours ago
Organic MarbleOrganic Marble
59.9k3165256
answered 4 hours ago
Organic MarbleOrganic Marble
59.9k3165256
answered 4 hours ago
Organic MarbleOrganic Marble
59.9k3165256
59.9k3165256
$begingroup$
Polytetrafluoroethylene is a plastic material, not a propellant. Unless they're burning plastic as fuel?
$endgroup$
– immibis
36 mins ago
$begingroup$
I am not sure what point you are trying to make. The quoted document is just saying that some of the PTFE is transferred from the bearing cages to the ball bearing and that this is the only substance actually acting as a lubricant. The bearings are cooled by propellant flow, oxygen for the oxygen pumps and hydrogen for the hydrogen pumps.
$endgroup$
– Organic Marble
35 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Polytetrafluoroethylene is a plastic material, not a propellant. Unless they're burning plastic as fuel?
$endgroup$
– immibis
36 mins ago
$begingroup$
I am not sure what point you are trying to make. The quoted document is just saying that some of the PTFE is transferred from the bearing cages to the ball bearing and that this is the only substance actually acting as a lubricant. The bearings are cooled by propellant flow, oxygen for the oxygen pumps and hydrogen for the hydrogen pumps.
$endgroup$
– Organic Marble
35 mins ago
$begingroup$
Polytetrafluoroethylene is a plastic material, not a propellant. Unless they're burning plastic as fuel?
$endgroup$
– immibis
36 mins ago
$begingroup$
Polytetrafluoroethylene is a plastic material, not a propellant. Unless they're burning plastic as fuel?
$endgroup$
– immibis
36 mins ago
$begingroup$
I am not sure what point you are trying to make. The quoted document is just saying that some of the PTFE is transferred from the bearing cages to the ball bearing and that this is the only substance actually acting as a lubricant. The bearings are cooled by propellant flow, oxygen for the oxygen pumps and hydrogen for the hydrogen pumps.
$endgroup$
– Organic Marble
35 mins ago
$begingroup$
I am not sure what point you are trying to make. The quoted document is just saying that some of the PTFE is transferred from the bearing cages to the ball bearing and that this is the only substance actually acting as a lubricant. The bearings are cooled by propellant flow, oxygen for the oxygen pumps and hydrogen for the hydrogen pumps.
$endgroup$
– Organic Marble
35 mins ago
add a comment |
Thanks for contributing an answer to Space Exploration Stack Exchange!
- Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!
But avoid …
- Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.
- Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.
Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.
To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fspace.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f35460%2fare-turbopumps-lubricated%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
1
$begingroup$
The fluid pumped may be used as lubricant too. A hyrdrocarbon lubricant could not be used for a liquid oxygen pump.
$endgroup$
– Uwe
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yep, using the working fluid as the lubricant is pretty common.
$endgroup$
– Russell Borogove
3 hours ago