Why did this character join Grindelwald?
I must admit, I entirely did not understand why
Queenie
chose to join Grindelwald at the climax of The Crimes of Grindelwald. She seems like the least likely, given her relationship with
Jacob.
Can anyone explain?
harry-potter fantastic-beasts the-crimes-of-grindelwald
asked Nov 20 '18 at 20:29
Azor AhaiAzor Ahai
78221225
|
show 4 more comments
I must admit, I entirely did not understand why
Queenie
chose to join Grindelwald at the climax of The Crimes of Grindelwald. She seems like the least likely, given her relationship with
Jacob.
Can anyone explain?
harry-potter fantastic-beasts the-crimes-of-grindelwald
asked Nov 20 '18 at 20:29
Azor AhaiAzor Ahai
78221225
3
I had this discussion with someone the other day, I was unable to come to a conclusion as to whether she was persuaded or Grindelwald had enchanted her.
– TheLethalCarrot
Nov 20 '18 at 20:43
@TheLethalCarrot I also thought she was enchanted (it would be appropriate turnabout for her actions earlier), but why would G want to enchant her specifically?
– Azor Ahai
Nov 20 '18 at 20:44
6
@TheLethalCarrot - She's an incredibly gifted witch with a power of legilimency unlike any we've seen. She would be an enormous asset to any rebellion
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 20:45
1
Her relationship is precisely what makes her more likely to join than your average witch in the street.
– Janus Bahs Jacquet
Nov 20 '18 at 22:31
3
@AzorAhai If I recall correctly, Grindelwald discovered she was a natural Legilimens in the first movie. This skill proves useful almost immediately after she joins him, when she is able to read Credence's mind and provide useful emotional information to Grindelwald. I find the notion that he bewitched her in some way far more convincing than her deciding to join with the darkest wizard of all time in the span of a single day.
– TylerH
Nov 21 '18 at 14:49
|
show 4 more comments
I must admit, I entirely did not understand why
Queenie
chose to join Grindelwald at the climax of The Crimes of Grindelwald. She seems like the least likely, given her relationship with
Jacob.
Can anyone explain?
harry-potter fantastic-beasts the-crimes-of-grindelwald
asked Nov 20 '18 at 20:29
Azor AhaiAzor Ahai
78221225
I must admit, I entirely did not understand why
Queenie
chose to join Grindelwald at the climax of The Crimes of Grindelwald. She seems like the least likely, given her relationship with
Jacob.
Can anyone explain?
harry-potter fantastic-beasts the-crimes-of-grindelwald
harry-potter fantastic-beasts the-crimes-of-grindelwald
asked Nov 20 '18 at 20:29
Azor AhaiAzor Ahai
78221225
asked Nov 20 '18 at 20:29
Azor AhaiAzor Ahai
78221225
edited Nov 20 '18 at 22:21
Azor Ahai
asked Nov 20 '18 at 20:29
Azor AhaiAzor Ahai
78221225
asked Nov 20 '18 at 20:29
Azor AhaiAzor Ahai
78221225
asked Nov 20 '18 at 20:29
Azor AhaiAzor Ahai
78221225
78221225
3
I had this discussion with someone the other day, I was unable to come to a conclusion as to whether she was persuaded or Grindelwald had enchanted her.
– TheLethalCarrot
Nov 20 '18 at 20:43
@TheLethalCarrot I also thought she was enchanted (it would be appropriate turnabout for her actions earlier), but why would G want to enchant her specifically?
– Azor Ahai
Nov 20 '18 at 20:44
6
@TheLethalCarrot - She's an incredibly gifted witch with a power of legilimency unlike any we've seen. She would be an enormous asset to any rebellion
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 20:45
1
Her relationship is precisely what makes her more likely to join than your average witch in the street.
– Janus Bahs Jacquet
Nov 20 '18 at 22:31
3
@AzorAhai If I recall correctly, Grindelwald discovered she was a natural Legilimens in the first movie. This skill proves useful almost immediately after she joins him, when she is able to read Credence's mind and provide useful emotional information to Grindelwald. I find the notion that he bewitched her in some way far more convincing than her deciding to join with the darkest wizard of all time in the span of a single day.
– TylerH
Nov 21 '18 at 14:49
|
show 4 more comments
3
I had this discussion with someone the other day, I was unable to come to a conclusion as to whether she was persuaded or Grindelwald had enchanted her.
– TheLethalCarrot
Nov 20 '18 at 20:43
@TheLethalCarrot I also thought she was enchanted (it would be appropriate turnabout for her actions earlier), but why would G want to enchant her specifically?
– Azor Ahai
Nov 20 '18 at 20:44
6
@TheLethalCarrot - She's an incredibly gifted witch with a power of legilimency unlike any we've seen. She would be an enormous asset to any rebellion
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 20:45
1
Her relationship is precisely what makes her more likely to join than your average witch in the street.
– Janus Bahs Jacquet
Nov 20 '18 at 22:31
3
@AzorAhai If I recall correctly, Grindelwald discovered she was a natural Legilimens in the first movie. This skill proves useful almost immediately after she joins him, when she is able to read Credence's mind and provide useful emotional information to Grindelwald. I find the notion that he bewitched her in some way far more convincing than her deciding to join with the darkest wizard of all time in the span of a single day.
– TylerH
Nov 21 '18 at 14:49
3
3
I had this discussion with someone the other day, I was unable to come to a conclusion as to whether she was persuaded or Grindelwald had enchanted her.
– TheLethalCarrot
Nov 20 '18 at 20:43
I had this discussion with someone the other day, I was unable to come to a conclusion as to whether she was persuaded or Grindelwald had enchanted her.
– TheLethalCarrot
Nov 20 '18 at 20:43
@TheLethalCarrot I also thought she was enchanted (it would be appropriate turnabout for her actions earlier), but why would G want to enchant her specifically?
– Azor Ahai
Nov 20 '18 at 20:44
@TheLethalCarrot I also thought she was enchanted (it would be appropriate turnabout for her actions earlier), but why would G want to enchant her specifically?
– Azor Ahai
Nov 20 '18 at 20:44
6
6
@TheLethalCarrot - She's an incredibly gifted witch with a power of legilimency unlike any we've seen. She would be an enormous asset to any rebellion
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 20:45
@TheLethalCarrot - She's an incredibly gifted witch with a power of legilimency unlike any we've seen. She would be an enormous asset to any rebellion
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 20:45
1
1
Her relationship is precisely what makes her more likely to join than your average witch in the street.
– Janus Bahs Jacquet
Nov 20 '18 at 22:31
Her relationship is precisely what makes her more likely to join than your average witch in the street.
– Janus Bahs Jacquet
Nov 20 '18 at 22:31
3
3
@AzorAhai If I recall correctly, Grindelwald discovered she was a natural Legilimens in the first movie. This skill proves useful almost immediately after she joins him, when she is able to read Credence's mind and provide useful emotional information to Grindelwald. I find the notion that he bewitched her in some way far more convincing than her deciding to join with the darkest wizard of all time in the span of a single day.
– TylerH
Nov 21 '18 at 14:49
@AzorAhai If I recall correctly, Grindelwald discovered she was a natural Legilimens in the first movie. This skill proves useful almost immediately after she joins him, when she is able to read Credence's mind and provide useful emotional information to Grindelwald. I find the notion that he bewitched her in some way far more convincing than her deciding to join with the darkest wizard of all time in the span of a single day.
– TylerH
Nov 21 '18 at 14:49
|
show 4 more comments
6 Answers
6
active
oldest
votes
At the start of the film we see that Queenie is struggling with the idea that Jacob can't/won't marry her because she'd become an outcast in wizarding society (essentially exiled from her home country) and he'd either be killed or obliviated.
JACOB: Okay, wait. We talked about this, like, a million times. If we get married and they find out, they’re gonna throw you in jail, sweetheart. I can’t have that. They don’t like people like me marrying people like you. I ain’t a wizard. I’m just me.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
When she meets Grindelwald, not only does he not turn out to be the psychopathic monster she's been told he is, but he also spins her a convincing lie about being free to love and marry muggles after the rebellion's completed.
GRINDELWALD: I would never see you harmed, ever. It is not your fault that your sister is an Auror. I wish you were working with me now towards a world where we wizards are free to live openly, and to love freely.
What's not clear (and may be explained later) is whether he's merely highly persuasive or whether his "silver tongue" is literally a form of magical enchantment. Either way, she makes her choice as a result of this conversation.
QUEENIE: [a decision] Jacob, he’s the answer. He wants what we want.
In an interview, the actress who portrays Queenie Alison Sudol says that it breaks down to three main elements; That those close to her don't value her magical gifts, that she feels abandoned by her sister (and by Jacob) and that Grindelwald appears to be promising a world in which those with her kinds of views will be valued.
“I feel like in some ways she’s too there and that’s part of the problem. She’s tapping into all human beings at all times and that’s a lot for one person to hold and everybody closest to her is always going, ‘Don’t read my mind.’ So she has a huge power and yet is made to feel like she’s nothing and that’s bad. That could make anyone feel crazy. And women historically have this huge intuition and have been punished for that intuition forever. How many women have been in a mental institution because they’ve been called crazy when they’re just not allowed to be honest or be who they are?”
“Jacob doesn’t come with her,” she explains. “It’s not so much about Jacob not coming with her to the dark side, it’s like, ‘Jacob, walk with me, we’re in this together.’ And she doesn’t have those two, so who does she have? Newt’s kind of betrayed her — he called her out, it was embarrassing. What does she have?”
“I still believe in her heart of hearts she’s going over to fight what she believes in,” Sudol says. “Grindelwald is saying, ‘we’re creating a different world’ and the world that she is in is broken. I don’t believe she’s turning evil. It’s more like she’s trying to find somebody who is giving her an option. He’s manipulating her but he’s manipulating everybody. He even did that with Dumbledore.”
EW.COM - Interview
answered Nov 20 '18 at 20:54
ValorumValorum
410k11129853209
3
Is it a lie? Grindelwald obviously wants wizards to rule everyone else, but he hasn't seemed too worried about blood purity the way Voldemort was.
– Adamant
Nov 20 '18 at 21:45
5
@Adamant - He's the ultimate blood purist. He's planning to utterly subjugate muggles. One of his followers is even keen to simply exterminate them
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 21:48
10
@Adamant - Since he's basically "wizard Hitler", I doubt if his goal is peaceful co-existence. That's just a line he feeds willing patsies.
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 22:08
17
@Adamant - GRINDELWALD: We don’t say such things out loud. We want only freedom. Freedom to be ourselves. ROSIER: To annihilate non-wizards. GRINDELWALD: Not all of them. Not all. We’re not merciless. The beast of burden will always be necessary.. Since he views muggles as little better than cattle and that his plan is to kill them by their millions, I find it very hard to believe that he's going to be especially pro-wizard/muggle marriages.
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 22:13
5
I think an important part of Queenie's decision that could be added to this answer is at the start when she says to Jacob that one of them has to be brave and if its not going to be him then it has to be her. We can see this as being her reasoning at the end as well. She goes with Grindelwald even though Jacob doesn't want her to go which might seem illogical, but from her perspective one of them has to be brave and actually do something to make a change and so she'll do it even if he won't. At least that's one interpretation
– Rhys
Nov 20 '18 at 23:45
|
show 8 more comments
SPOILER ALERT
An obvious reason (properly described by @Valorum) is being able to marry Jacob. It's her greatest desire, and she sees Grindelwald's way is the only way to achieve that. It's like the last resort for her: either that or nothing. She doesn't seem to think deeply about the possible consequences.
But there is more to it.
She really shares Grindelwald's views, though in a more naive way.
Although Queenie looks like a nice person, she already showed that the idea of using magic over muggles "for greater good" is fine with her. She put a spell on Jacob to make him stay with her, which is a pure violation of an individual's free will, but she thought she had the right to decide what is best, exactly because she had the power to benefit them both (as she saw it). Apparently using such methods on a no-maj seems legit to her, though she would probably think twice if Jacob was a wizard himself.
She also doesn't ever seem to think she should limit her mind reading to respect others' privacy. It's quite straightforward for her: you've got the power, you use it. If you are a good person, then everybody will just benefit from it, right?
Queenie is shown as a sweet, but rather naive person who does not think deeply about a problem, which makes her see right and wrong in a very narrow way. That's also the reason she can be easily persuaded. It didn't seem to take much effort from Newt to persuade her she shouldn't have put the spell on Jacob; in the same way, it was easy enough for Grindelwald to persuade her into his ideas.
So it is possible Queenie genuinely shares Grindelwald's views that wizards are allowed to use their powers if this is for "greater good."
edited Nov 22 '18 at 3:10
sudhanva
3,96221854
answered Nov 21 '18 at 10:38
Shana TarShana Tar
3,80122147
add a comment |
When Queenie met with Grindelwald earlier in the movie, he swayed her by hinting that the current laws banning marriage between Muggles and Wizards/Witches would no longer exist and that if she were to follow him, that she would be free to marry who she wished.
edited Nov 20 '18 at 21:52
TheLethalCarrot
47.2k17250298
answered Nov 20 '18 at 20:42
John GrabanskiJohn Grabanski
32016
add a comment |
Because she heard what she wanted to hear
To avoid a spoiler-formatting "hell", this post contains unprotected spoiler information
In Crimes of Grindelwald
Queenie
join forces with Grindelwald at the end.
As others have suggested before, Queenie was in love with a Non-Wizard and by the standards of the late 20's Wizarding Society, marrying between Muggles and Wizards was considered a taboo; maybe it was also forbidden.
Quoting a dialogue from the movie,
JACOB: Okay, wait. We talked about this, like, a million times. If we get married and they find out, they’re gonna throw you in jail, sweetheart. I can’t have that. They don’t like people like me marrying people like you. I ain’t a wizard. I’m just me.
-Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Script
For this sole reason, at the beginning of the movie, she left him and throughout it, she seemed to be deeply affected by her choice. Later, when she met Grindelwald in Paris, she surrendered all her defenses. She heard what she wanted to hear. Of a world that she can leave freely without the "limitations" of the past.
Grindelwald, after all, is mentioned to have been an extremely charismatic man, who not only persuaded thousands to join him, but persuaded none other than Albus Dumbledore himself in his quest to rule Muggles for the Greater Good. If Albus Dumbledore was deceived that easy, what chances did poor Queenie had?
The real question would be why Grindelwald was so hesitant in making her join him. For that I guess, we will have to wait to find out.
answered Nov 21 '18 at 8:29
Lefteris008Lefteris008
2,006826
add a comment |
It’s unclear exactly but it would appear to be either because Grindelwald persuaded or enchanted her. I’ll detail reasons for both below:
Both
Grindelwald is described as being very persuasive and having a silver tongue. This could be a reason to say he is either very persuasive or is enchanting people.
PICQUERY It was necessary. He’s extremely powerful. We’ve had to change his guard three times—he’s very... persuasive. So we removed his tongue.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
SPIELMAN No more silver tongue, eh?
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
Persuasion
Grindelwald appears to have persuaded Abernathy to join his cause, this shows how persuasive he is and lays some foreshadowing down for persuasion, like he does to Credence at the end of the film too.
GRINDELWALD appears at the door and nods to ABERNATHY. He throws the door open so the water pours out—along with the two remaining AURORS. GRINDELWALD clambers inside and retrieves the vial from ABERNATHY’S mouth by the chain, casting a spell that grants ABERNATHY a new forked tongue.
GRINDELWALD You have joined a noble cause, my friend.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
NAGINI grabs CREDENCE and tries to drag him away with her, but he is staring at GRINDELWALD.
CREDENCE He knows who I am.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
Like with Credence, Grindelwald says what Queenie wants to hear to get her to join him. Here he picks at her wanting to marry Jacob, a Muggle, which is currently illegal.
QUEENIE Oh well, you know, she found out about Jacob and I seeing each other and she didn’t like it, ’cause of the “law.” (miming quotation marks) Not allowed to date No-Majs, not allowed to marry them. Blah, blah, blah. Well, she was all in a tizzy anyway, ’cause of you.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
GRINDELWALD I would never see you harmed, ever. It is not your fault that your sister is an Auror. I wish you were working with me now towards a world where we wizards are free to live openly, and to love freely.
GRINDELWALD’S hand touches her wand-tip and lowers it.
GRINDELWALD You are an innocent. So go now. Leave this place.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
QUEENIE (a decision) Jacob, he’s the answer. He wants what we want.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
Enchanted
Of course earlier on we have the foreshadowing of people being enchanted when Queenie has enchanted Jacob.
NEWT (V.O.) (speaking telepathically) You’ve enchanted him, haven’t you?
QUEENIE (reading his mind) What? I have not.
NEWT Will you stop reading my mind speaking telepathically) Queenie, you’ve brought him here against his will.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
It would also appear that Jacob believes she is enchanted, however, this could just be in desperation.
ANGLE ON QUEENIE AND JACOB, who are pressed up against a different stretch of wall.
JACOB Queenie. You gotta wake up.
QUEENIE (a decision) Jacob, he’s the answer. He wants what we want.
JACOB No, no, no, no, no, no.
QUEENIE Yeah.
JACOB No.
[...]
ANGLE ON QUEENIE AND JACOB.
QUEENIE Walk with me.
JACOB Honey, no!
QUEENIE (screams) Walk with me!
JACOB You’re crazy.
She reads his mind, turns, hesitates, then walks into the black fire.
JACOB (desperate, disbelieving) No! Queenie, don’t do it!”
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
answered Nov 20 '18 at 21:17
TheLethalCarrotTheLethalCarrot
47.2k17250298
3
I was under the impression that they showed Jacob 'enchanted' (and basically drunk) in order to show that Queenie had been legitimately convinced without magical involvement
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 21:20
@Valorum I suppose like a lot of the stuff it can be interpreted both ways.
– TheLethalCarrot
Nov 20 '18 at 21:21
add a comment |
This is just my opinion. Think about what time period we're talking about. It's the 1920s. If Queenie were perhaps pregnant, that would explain her despair on the streets of Paris, her frustration at Jacob refusing to marry her and her feeling like she didn't matter. Women in pre 1970s were treated horribly if they were pregnant without being married and Queenie finds herself wanting to marry a man she would be imprisoned for dating, let alone having a child with. She cannot go back to America and Jacob won't marry her for fear she'll get in trouble. That makes her motivation more understandable at least to me.
answered 2 days ago
Cathy SolowayCathy Soloway
11
New contributor
Cathy Soloway is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
1
Is there any reason to assume that this is the case, or is it merely your own personal headcanon?
– Valorum
2 days ago
1
Welcome to the site! I have not seen the new film as of yet, but if you could provide some reasons and/or examples from the film or book that support your opinion it would make your answer much better. We try to stick as close to facts as possible on this (and the other stack exchange) sites. Sometimes opinion is unavoidable or enlightening, but without providing examples you are unlikely to get any support for your theory.
– Odin1806
2 days ago
add a comment |
Your Answer
StackExchange.ready(function() {
var channelOptions = {
tags: "".split(" "),
id: "186"
};
initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);
StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function() {
// Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled) {
StackExchange.using("snippets", function() {
createEditor();
});
}
else {
createEditor();
}
});
function createEditor() {
StackExchange.prepareEditor({
heartbeatType: 'answer',
autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
convertImagesToLinks: false,
noModals: true,
showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
reputationToPostImages: null,
bindNavPrevention: true,
postfix: "",
imageUploader: {
brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
allowUrls: true
},
noCode: true, onDemand: true,
discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
});
}
});
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fscifi.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f198993%2fwhy-did-this-character-join-grindelwald%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
6 Answers
6
active
oldest
votes
6 Answers
6
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
At the start of the film we see that Queenie is struggling with the idea that Jacob can't/won't marry her because she'd become an outcast in wizarding society (essentially exiled from her home country) and he'd either be killed or obliviated.
JACOB: Okay, wait. We talked about this, like, a million times. If we get married and they find out, they’re gonna throw you in jail, sweetheart. I can’t have that. They don’t like people like me marrying people like you. I ain’t a wizard. I’m just me.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
When she meets Grindelwald, not only does he not turn out to be the psychopathic monster she's been told he is, but he also spins her a convincing lie about being free to love and marry muggles after the rebellion's completed.
GRINDELWALD: I would never see you harmed, ever. It is not your fault that your sister is an Auror. I wish you were working with me now towards a world where we wizards are free to live openly, and to love freely.
What's not clear (and may be explained later) is whether he's merely highly persuasive or whether his "silver tongue" is literally a form of magical enchantment. Either way, she makes her choice as a result of this conversation.
QUEENIE: [a decision] Jacob, he’s the answer. He wants what we want.
In an interview, the actress who portrays Queenie Alison Sudol says that it breaks down to three main elements; That those close to her don't value her magical gifts, that she feels abandoned by her sister (and by Jacob) and that Grindelwald appears to be promising a world in which those with her kinds of views will be valued.
“I feel like in some ways she’s too there and that’s part of the problem. She’s tapping into all human beings at all times and that’s a lot for one person to hold and everybody closest to her is always going, ‘Don’t read my mind.’ So she has a huge power and yet is made to feel like she’s nothing and that’s bad. That could make anyone feel crazy. And women historically have this huge intuition and have been punished for that intuition forever. How many women have been in a mental institution because they’ve been called crazy when they’re just not allowed to be honest or be who they are?”
“Jacob doesn’t come with her,” she explains. “It’s not so much about Jacob not coming with her to the dark side, it’s like, ‘Jacob, walk with me, we’re in this together.’ And she doesn’t have those two, so who does she have? Newt’s kind of betrayed her — he called her out, it was embarrassing. What does she have?”
“I still believe in her heart of hearts she’s going over to fight what she believes in,” Sudol says. “Grindelwald is saying, ‘we’re creating a different world’ and the world that she is in is broken. I don’t believe she’s turning evil. It’s more like she’s trying to find somebody who is giving her an option. He’s manipulating her but he’s manipulating everybody. He even did that with Dumbledore.”
EW.COM - Interview
answered Nov 20 '18 at 20:54
ValorumValorum
410k11129853209
3
Is it a lie? Grindelwald obviously wants wizards to rule everyone else, but he hasn't seemed too worried about blood purity the way Voldemort was.
– Adamant
Nov 20 '18 at 21:45
5
@Adamant - He's the ultimate blood purist. He's planning to utterly subjugate muggles. One of his followers is even keen to simply exterminate them
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 21:48
10
@Adamant - Since he's basically "wizard Hitler", I doubt if his goal is peaceful co-existence. That's just a line he feeds willing patsies.
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 22:08
17
@Adamant - GRINDELWALD: We don’t say such things out loud. We want only freedom. Freedom to be ourselves. ROSIER: To annihilate non-wizards. GRINDELWALD: Not all of them. Not all. We’re not merciless. The beast of burden will always be necessary.. Since he views muggles as little better than cattle and that his plan is to kill them by their millions, I find it very hard to believe that he's going to be especially pro-wizard/muggle marriages.
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 22:13
5
I think an important part of Queenie's decision that could be added to this answer is at the start when she says to Jacob that one of them has to be brave and if its not going to be him then it has to be her. We can see this as being her reasoning at the end as well. She goes with Grindelwald even though Jacob doesn't want her to go which might seem illogical, but from her perspective one of them has to be brave and actually do something to make a change and so she'll do it even if he won't. At least that's one interpretation
– Rhys
Nov 20 '18 at 23:45
|
show 8 more comments
At the start of the film we see that Queenie is struggling with the idea that Jacob can't/won't marry her because she'd become an outcast in wizarding society (essentially exiled from her home country) and he'd either be killed or obliviated.
JACOB: Okay, wait. We talked about this, like, a million times. If we get married and they find out, they’re gonna throw you in jail, sweetheart. I can’t have that. They don’t like people like me marrying people like you. I ain’t a wizard. I’m just me.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
When she meets Grindelwald, not only does he not turn out to be the psychopathic monster she's been told he is, but he also spins her a convincing lie about being free to love and marry muggles after the rebellion's completed.
GRINDELWALD: I would never see you harmed, ever. It is not your fault that your sister is an Auror. I wish you were working with me now towards a world where we wizards are free to live openly, and to love freely.
What's not clear (and may be explained later) is whether he's merely highly persuasive or whether his "silver tongue" is literally a form of magical enchantment. Either way, she makes her choice as a result of this conversation.
QUEENIE: [a decision] Jacob, he’s the answer. He wants what we want.
In an interview, the actress who portrays Queenie Alison Sudol says that it breaks down to three main elements; That those close to her don't value her magical gifts, that she feels abandoned by her sister (and by Jacob) and that Grindelwald appears to be promising a world in which those with her kinds of views will be valued.
“I feel like in some ways she’s too there and that’s part of the problem. She’s tapping into all human beings at all times and that’s a lot for one person to hold and everybody closest to her is always going, ‘Don’t read my mind.’ So she has a huge power and yet is made to feel like she’s nothing and that’s bad. That could make anyone feel crazy. And women historically have this huge intuition and have been punished for that intuition forever. How many women have been in a mental institution because they’ve been called crazy when they’re just not allowed to be honest or be who they are?”
“Jacob doesn’t come with her,” she explains. “It’s not so much about Jacob not coming with her to the dark side, it’s like, ‘Jacob, walk with me, we’re in this together.’ And she doesn’t have those two, so who does she have? Newt’s kind of betrayed her — he called her out, it was embarrassing. What does she have?”
“I still believe in her heart of hearts she’s going over to fight what she believes in,” Sudol says. “Grindelwald is saying, ‘we’re creating a different world’ and the world that she is in is broken. I don’t believe she’s turning evil. It’s more like she’s trying to find somebody who is giving her an option. He’s manipulating her but he’s manipulating everybody. He even did that with Dumbledore.”
EW.COM - Interview
answered Nov 20 '18 at 20:54
ValorumValorum
410k11129853209
3
Is it a lie? Grindelwald obviously wants wizards to rule everyone else, but he hasn't seemed too worried about blood purity the way Voldemort was.
– Adamant
Nov 20 '18 at 21:45
5
@Adamant - He's the ultimate blood purist. He's planning to utterly subjugate muggles. One of his followers is even keen to simply exterminate them
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 21:48
10
@Adamant - Since he's basically "wizard Hitler", I doubt if his goal is peaceful co-existence. That's just a line he feeds willing patsies.
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 22:08
17
@Adamant - GRINDELWALD: We don’t say such things out loud. We want only freedom. Freedom to be ourselves. ROSIER: To annihilate non-wizards. GRINDELWALD: Not all of them. Not all. We’re not merciless. The beast of burden will always be necessary.. Since he views muggles as little better than cattle and that his plan is to kill them by their millions, I find it very hard to believe that he's going to be especially pro-wizard/muggle marriages.
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 22:13
5
I think an important part of Queenie's decision that could be added to this answer is at the start when she says to Jacob that one of them has to be brave and if its not going to be him then it has to be her. We can see this as being her reasoning at the end as well. She goes with Grindelwald even though Jacob doesn't want her to go which might seem illogical, but from her perspective one of them has to be brave and actually do something to make a change and so she'll do it even if he won't. At least that's one interpretation
– Rhys
Nov 20 '18 at 23:45
|
show 8 more comments
At the start of the film we see that Queenie is struggling with the idea that Jacob can't/won't marry her because she'd become an outcast in wizarding society (essentially exiled from her home country) and he'd either be killed or obliviated.
JACOB: Okay, wait. We talked about this, like, a million times. If we get married and they find out, they’re gonna throw you in jail, sweetheart. I can’t have that. They don’t like people like me marrying people like you. I ain’t a wizard. I’m just me.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
When she meets Grindelwald, not only does he not turn out to be the psychopathic monster she's been told he is, but he also spins her a convincing lie about being free to love and marry muggles after the rebellion's completed.
GRINDELWALD: I would never see you harmed, ever. It is not your fault that your sister is an Auror. I wish you were working with me now towards a world where we wizards are free to live openly, and to love freely.
What's not clear (and may be explained later) is whether he's merely highly persuasive or whether his "silver tongue" is literally a form of magical enchantment. Either way, she makes her choice as a result of this conversation.
QUEENIE: [a decision] Jacob, he’s the answer. He wants what we want.
In an interview, the actress who portrays Queenie Alison Sudol says that it breaks down to three main elements; That those close to her don't value her magical gifts, that she feels abandoned by her sister (and by Jacob) and that Grindelwald appears to be promising a world in which those with her kinds of views will be valued.
“I feel like in some ways she’s too there and that’s part of the problem. She’s tapping into all human beings at all times and that’s a lot for one person to hold and everybody closest to her is always going, ‘Don’t read my mind.’ So she has a huge power and yet is made to feel like she’s nothing and that’s bad. That could make anyone feel crazy. And women historically have this huge intuition and have been punished for that intuition forever. How many women have been in a mental institution because they’ve been called crazy when they’re just not allowed to be honest or be who they are?”
“Jacob doesn’t come with her,” she explains. “It’s not so much about Jacob not coming with her to the dark side, it’s like, ‘Jacob, walk with me, we’re in this together.’ And she doesn’t have those two, so who does she have? Newt’s kind of betrayed her — he called her out, it was embarrassing. What does she have?”
“I still believe in her heart of hearts she’s going over to fight what she believes in,” Sudol says. “Grindelwald is saying, ‘we’re creating a different world’ and the world that she is in is broken. I don’t believe she’s turning evil. It’s more like she’s trying to find somebody who is giving her an option. He’s manipulating her but he’s manipulating everybody. He even did that with Dumbledore.”
EW.COM - Interview
answered Nov 20 '18 at 20:54
ValorumValorum
410k11129853209
At the start of the film we see that Queenie is struggling with the idea that Jacob can't/won't marry her because she'd become an outcast in wizarding society (essentially exiled from her home country) and he'd either be killed or obliviated.
JACOB: Okay, wait. We talked about this, like, a million times. If we get married and they find out, they’re gonna throw you in jail, sweetheart. I can’t have that. They don’t like people like me marrying people like you. I ain’t a wizard. I’m just me.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
When she meets Grindelwald, not only does he not turn out to be the psychopathic monster she's been told he is, but he also spins her a convincing lie about being free to love and marry muggles after the rebellion's completed.
GRINDELWALD: I would never see you harmed, ever. It is not your fault that your sister is an Auror. I wish you were working with me now towards a world where we wizards are free to live openly, and to love freely.
What's not clear (and may be explained later) is whether he's merely highly persuasive or whether his "silver tongue" is literally a form of magical enchantment. Either way, she makes her choice as a result of this conversation.
QUEENIE: [a decision] Jacob, he’s the answer. He wants what we want.
In an interview, the actress who portrays Queenie Alison Sudol says that it breaks down to three main elements; That those close to her don't value her magical gifts, that she feels abandoned by her sister (and by Jacob) and that Grindelwald appears to be promising a world in which those with her kinds of views will be valued.
“I feel like in some ways she’s too there and that’s part of the problem. She’s tapping into all human beings at all times and that’s a lot for one person to hold and everybody closest to her is always going, ‘Don’t read my mind.’ So she has a huge power and yet is made to feel like she’s nothing and that’s bad. That could make anyone feel crazy. And women historically have this huge intuition and have been punished for that intuition forever. How many women have been in a mental institution because they’ve been called crazy when they’re just not allowed to be honest or be who they are?”
“Jacob doesn’t come with her,” she explains. “It’s not so much about Jacob not coming with her to the dark side, it’s like, ‘Jacob, walk with me, we’re in this together.’ And she doesn’t have those two, so who does she have? Newt’s kind of betrayed her — he called her out, it was embarrassing. What does she have?”
“I still believe in her heart of hearts she’s going over to fight what she believes in,” Sudol says. “Grindelwald is saying, ‘we’re creating a different world’ and the world that she is in is broken. I don’t believe she’s turning evil. It’s more like she’s trying to find somebody who is giving her an option. He’s manipulating her but he’s manipulating everybody. He even did that with Dumbledore.”
EW.COM - Interview
answered Nov 20 '18 at 20:54
ValorumValorum
410k11129853209
edited Nov 21 '18 at 11:45
answered Nov 20 '18 at 20:54
ValorumValorum
410k11129853209
answered Nov 20 '18 at 20:54
ValorumValorum
410k11129853209
answered Nov 20 '18 at 20:54
ValorumValorum
410k11129853209
410k11129853209
3
Is it a lie? Grindelwald obviously wants wizards to rule everyone else, but he hasn't seemed too worried about blood purity the way Voldemort was.
– Adamant
Nov 20 '18 at 21:45
5
@Adamant - He's the ultimate blood purist. He's planning to utterly subjugate muggles. One of his followers is even keen to simply exterminate them
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 21:48
10
@Adamant - Since he's basically "wizard Hitler", I doubt if his goal is peaceful co-existence. That's just a line he feeds willing patsies.
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 22:08
17
@Adamant - GRINDELWALD: We don’t say such things out loud. We want only freedom. Freedom to be ourselves. ROSIER: To annihilate non-wizards. GRINDELWALD: Not all of them. Not all. We’re not merciless. The beast of burden will always be necessary.. Since he views muggles as little better than cattle and that his plan is to kill them by their millions, I find it very hard to believe that he's going to be especially pro-wizard/muggle marriages.
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 22:13
5
I think an important part of Queenie's decision that could be added to this answer is at the start when she says to Jacob that one of them has to be brave and if its not going to be him then it has to be her. We can see this as being her reasoning at the end as well. She goes with Grindelwald even though Jacob doesn't want her to go which might seem illogical, but from her perspective one of them has to be brave and actually do something to make a change and so she'll do it even if he won't. At least that's one interpretation
– Rhys
Nov 20 '18 at 23:45
|
show 8 more comments
3
Is it a lie? Grindelwald obviously wants wizards to rule everyone else, but he hasn't seemed too worried about blood purity the way Voldemort was.
– Adamant
Nov 20 '18 at 21:45
5
@Adamant - He's the ultimate blood purist. He's planning to utterly subjugate muggles. One of his followers is even keen to simply exterminate them
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 21:48
10
@Adamant - Since he's basically "wizard Hitler", I doubt if his goal is peaceful co-existence. That's just a line he feeds willing patsies.
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 22:08
17
@Adamant - GRINDELWALD: We don’t say such things out loud. We want only freedom. Freedom to be ourselves. ROSIER: To annihilate non-wizards. GRINDELWALD: Not all of them. Not all. We’re not merciless. The beast of burden will always be necessary.. Since he views muggles as little better than cattle and that his plan is to kill them by their millions, I find it very hard to believe that he's going to be especially pro-wizard/muggle marriages.
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 22:13
5
I think an important part of Queenie's decision that could be added to this answer is at the start when she says to Jacob that one of them has to be brave and if its not going to be him then it has to be her. We can see this as being her reasoning at the end as well. She goes with Grindelwald even though Jacob doesn't want her to go which might seem illogical, but from her perspective one of them has to be brave and actually do something to make a change and so she'll do it even if he won't. At least that's one interpretation
– Rhys
Nov 20 '18 at 23:45
3
3
Is it a lie? Grindelwald obviously wants wizards to rule everyone else, but he hasn't seemed too worried about blood purity the way Voldemort was.
– Adamant
Nov 20 '18 at 21:45
Is it a lie? Grindelwald obviously wants wizards to rule everyone else, but he hasn't seemed too worried about blood purity the way Voldemort was.
– Adamant
Nov 20 '18 at 21:45
5
5
@Adamant - He's the ultimate blood purist. He's planning to utterly subjugate muggles. One of his followers is even keen to simply exterminate them
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 21:48
@Adamant - He's the ultimate blood purist. He's planning to utterly subjugate muggles. One of his followers is even keen to simply exterminate them
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 21:48
10
10
@Adamant - Since he's basically "wizard Hitler", I doubt if his goal is peaceful co-existence. That's just a line he feeds willing patsies.
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 22:08
@Adamant - Since he's basically "wizard Hitler", I doubt if his goal is peaceful co-existence. That's just a line he feeds willing patsies.
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 22:08
17
17
@Adamant - GRINDELWALD: We don’t say such things out loud. We want only freedom. Freedom to be ourselves. ROSIER: To annihilate non-wizards. GRINDELWALD: Not all of them. Not all. We’re not merciless. The beast of burden will always be necessary.. Since he views muggles as little better than cattle and that his plan is to kill them by their millions, I find it very hard to believe that he's going to be especially pro-wizard/muggle marriages.
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 22:13
@Adamant - GRINDELWALD: We don’t say such things out loud. We want only freedom. Freedom to be ourselves. ROSIER: To annihilate non-wizards. GRINDELWALD: Not all of them. Not all. We’re not merciless. The beast of burden will always be necessary.. Since he views muggles as little better than cattle and that his plan is to kill them by their millions, I find it very hard to believe that he's going to be especially pro-wizard/muggle marriages.
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 22:13
5
5
I think an important part of Queenie's decision that could be added to this answer is at the start when she says to Jacob that one of them has to be brave and if its not going to be him then it has to be her. We can see this as being her reasoning at the end as well. She goes with Grindelwald even though Jacob doesn't want her to go which might seem illogical, but from her perspective one of them has to be brave and actually do something to make a change and so she'll do it even if he won't. At least that's one interpretation
– Rhys
Nov 20 '18 at 23:45
I think an important part of Queenie's decision that could be added to this answer is at the start when she says to Jacob that one of them has to be brave and if its not going to be him then it has to be her. We can see this as being her reasoning at the end as well. She goes with Grindelwald even though Jacob doesn't want her to go which might seem illogical, but from her perspective one of them has to be brave and actually do something to make a change and so she'll do it even if he won't. At least that's one interpretation
– Rhys
Nov 20 '18 at 23:45
|
show 8 more comments
SPOILER ALERT
An obvious reason (properly described by @Valorum) is being able to marry Jacob. It's her greatest desire, and she sees Grindelwald's way is the only way to achieve that. It's like the last resort for her: either that or nothing. She doesn't seem to think deeply about the possible consequences.
But there is more to it.
She really shares Grindelwald's views, though in a more naive way.
Although Queenie looks like a nice person, she already showed that the idea of using magic over muggles "for greater good" is fine with her. She put a spell on Jacob to make him stay with her, which is a pure violation of an individual's free will, but she thought she had the right to decide what is best, exactly because she had the power to benefit them both (as she saw it). Apparently using such methods on a no-maj seems legit to her, though she would probably think twice if Jacob was a wizard himself.
She also doesn't ever seem to think she should limit her mind reading to respect others' privacy. It's quite straightforward for her: you've got the power, you use it. If you are a good person, then everybody will just benefit from it, right?
Queenie is shown as a sweet, but rather naive person who does not think deeply about a problem, which makes her see right and wrong in a very narrow way. That's also the reason she can be easily persuaded. It didn't seem to take much effort from Newt to persuade her she shouldn't have put the spell on Jacob; in the same way, it was easy enough for Grindelwald to persuade her into his ideas.
So it is possible Queenie genuinely shares Grindelwald's views that wizards are allowed to use their powers if this is for "greater good."
edited Nov 22 '18 at 3:10
sudhanva
3,96221854
answered Nov 21 '18 at 10:38
Shana TarShana Tar
3,80122147
add a comment |
SPOILER ALERT
An obvious reason (properly described by @Valorum) is being able to marry Jacob. It's her greatest desire, and she sees Grindelwald's way is the only way to achieve that. It's like the last resort for her: either that or nothing. She doesn't seem to think deeply about the possible consequences.
But there is more to it.
She really shares Grindelwald's views, though in a more naive way.
Although Queenie looks like a nice person, she already showed that the idea of using magic over muggles "for greater good" is fine with her. She put a spell on Jacob to make him stay with her, which is a pure violation of an individual's free will, but she thought she had the right to decide what is best, exactly because she had the power to benefit them both (as she saw it). Apparently using such methods on a no-maj seems legit to her, though she would probably think twice if Jacob was a wizard himself.
She also doesn't ever seem to think she should limit her mind reading to respect others' privacy. It's quite straightforward for her: you've got the power, you use it. If you are a good person, then everybody will just benefit from it, right?
Queenie is shown as a sweet, but rather naive person who does not think deeply about a problem, which makes her see right and wrong in a very narrow way. That's also the reason she can be easily persuaded. It didn't seem to take much effort from Newt to persuade her she shouldn't have put the spell on Jacob; in the same way, it was easy enough for Grindelwald to persuade her into his ideas.
So it is possible Queenie genuinely shares Grindelwald's views that wizards are allowed to use their powers if this is for "greater good."
edited Nov 22 '18 at 3:10
sudhanva
3,96221854
answered Nov 21 '18 at 10:38
Shana TarShana Tar
3,80122147
add a comment |
SPOILER ALERT
An obvious reason (properly described by @Valorum) is being able to marry Jacob. It's her greatest desire, and she sees Grindelwald's way is the only way to achieve that. It's like the last resort for her: either that or nothing. She doesn't seem to think deeply about the possible consequences.
But there is more to it.
She really shares Grindelwald's views, though in a more naive way.
Although Queenie looks like a nice person, she already showed that the idea of using magic over muggles "for greater good" is fine with her. She put a spell on Jacob to make him stay with her, which is a pure violation of an individual's free will, but she thought she had the right to decide what is best, exactly because she had the power to benefit them both (as she saw it). Apparently using such methods on a no-maj seems legit to her, though she would probably think twice if Jacob was a wizard himself.
She also doesn't ever seem to think she should limit her mind reading to respect others' privacy. It's quite straightforward for her: you've got the power, you use it. If you are a good person, then everybody will just benefit from it, right?
Queenie is shown as a sweet, but rather naive person who does not think deeply about a problem, which makes her see right and wrong in a very narrow way. That's also the reason she can be easily persuaded. It didn't seem to take much effort from Newt to persuade her she shouldn't have put the spell on Jacob; in the same way, it was easy enough for Grindelwald to persuade her into his ideas.
So it is possible Queenie genuinely shares Grindelwald's views that wizards are allowed to use their powers if this is for "greater good."
edited Nov 22 '18 at 3:10
sudhanva
3,96221854
answered Nov 21 '18 at 10:38
Shana TarShana Tar
3,80122147
SPOILER ALERT
An obvious reason (properly described by @Valorum) is being able to marry Jacob. It's her greatest desire, and she sees Grindelwald's way is the only way to achieve that. It's like the last resort for her: either that or nothing. She doesn't seem to think deeply about the possible consequences.
But there is more to it.
She really shares Grindelwald's views, though in a more naive way.
Although Queenie looks like a nice person, she already showed that the idea of using magic over muggles "for greater good" is fine with her. She put a spell on Jacob to make him stay with her, which is a pure violation of an individual's free will, but she thought she had the right to decide what is best, exactly because she had the power to benefit them both (as she saw it). Apparently using such methods on a no-maj seems legit to her, though she would probably think twice if Jacob was a wizard himself.
She also doesn't ever seem to think she should limit her mind reading to respect others' privacy. It's quite straightforward for her: you've got the power, you use it. If you are a good person, then everybody will just benefit from it, right?
Queenie is shown as a sweet, but rather naive person who does not think deeply about a problem, which makes her see right and wrong in a very narrow way. That's also the reason she can be easily persuaded. It didn't seem to take much effort from Newt to persuade her she shouldn't have put the spell on Jacob; in the same way, it was easy enough for Grindelwald to persuade her into his ideas.
So it is possible Queenie genuinely shares Grindelwald's views that wizards are allowed to use their powers if this is for "greater good."
edited Nov 22 '18 at 3:10
sudhanva
3,96221854
answered Nov 21 '18 at 10:38
Shana TarShana Tar
3,80122147
edited Nov 22 '18 at 3:10
sudhanva
3,96221854
edited Nov 22 '18 at 3:10
sudhanva
3,96221854
edited Nov 22 '18 at 3:10
sudhanva
3,96221854
3,96221854
answered Nov 21 '18 at 10:38
Shana TarShana Tar
3,80122147
answered Nov 21 '18 at 10:38
Shana TarShana Tar
3,80122147
answered Nov 21 '18 at 10:38
Shana TarShana Tar
3,80122147
3,80122147
add a comment |
add a comment |
When Queenie met with Grindelwald earlier in the movie, he swayed her by hinting that the current laws banning marriage between Muggles and Wizards/Witches would no longer exist and that if she were to follow him, that she would be free to marry who she wished.
edited Nov 20 '18 at 21:52
TheLethalCarrot
47.2k17250298
answered Nov 20 '18 at 20:42
John GrabanskiJohn Grabanski
32016
add a comment |
When Queenie met with Grindelwald earlier in the movie, he swayed her by hinting that the current laws banning marriage between Muggles and Wizards/Witches would no longer exist and that if she were to follow him, that she would be free to marry who she wished.
edited Nov 20 '18 at 21:52
TheLethalCarrot
47.2k17250298
answered Nov 20 '18 at 20:42
John GrabanskiJohn Grabanski
32016
add a comment |
When Queenie met with Grindelwald earlier in the movie, he swayed her by hinting that the current laws banning marriage between Muggles and Wizards/Witches would no longer exist and that if she were to follow him, that she would be free to marry who she wished.
edited Nov 20 '18 at 21:52
TheLethalCarrot
47.2k17250298
answered Nov 20 '18 at 20:42
John GrabanskiJohn Grabanski
32016
When Queenie met with Grindelwald earlier in the movie, he swayed her by hinting that the current laws banning marriage between Muggles and Wizards/Witches would no longer exist and that if she were to follow him, that she would be free to marry who she wished.
edited Nov 20 '18 at 21:52
TheLethalCarrot
47.2k17250298
answered Nov 20 '18 at 20:42
John GrabanskiJohn Grabanski
32016
edited Nov 20 '18 at 21:52
TheLethalCarrot
47.2k17250298
edited Nov 20 '18 at 21:52
TheLethalCarrot
47.2k17250298
edited Nov 20 '18 at 21:52
TheLethalCarrot
47.2k17250298
47.2k17250298
answered Nov 20 '18 at 20:42
John GrabanskiJohn Grabanski
32016
answered Nov 20 '18 at 20:42
John GrabanskiJohn Grabanski
32016
answered Nov 20 '18 at 20:42
John GrabanskiJohn Grabanski
32016
32016
add a comment |
add a comment |
Because she heard what she wanted to hear
To avoid a spoiler-formatting "hell", this post contains unprotected spoiler information
In Crimes of Grindelwald
Queenie
join forces with Grindelwald at the end.
As others have suggested before, Queenie was in love with a Non-Wizard and by the standards of the late 20's Wizarding Society, marrying between Muggles and Wizards was considered a taboo; maybe it was also forbidden.
Quoting a dialogue from the movie,
JACOB: Okay, wait. We talked about this, like, a million times. If we get married and they find out, they’re gonna throw you in jail, sweetheart. I can’t have that. They don’t like people like me marrying people like you. I ain’t a wizard. I’m just me.
-Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Script
For this sole reason, at the beginning of the movie, she left him and throughout it, she seemed to be deeply affected by her choice. Later, when she met Grindelwald in Paris, she surrendered all her defenses. She heard what she wanted to hear. Of a world that she can leave freely without the "limitations" of the past.
Grindelwald, after all, is mentioned to have been an extremely charismatic man, who not only persuaded thousands to join him, but persuaded none other than Albus Dumbledore himself in his quest to rule Muggles for the Greater Good. If Albus Dumbledore was deceived that easy, what chances did poor Queenie had?
The real question would be why Grindelwald was so hesitant in making her join him. For that I guess, we will have to wait to find out.
answered Nov 21 '18 at 8:29
Lefteris008Lefteris008
2,006826
add a comment |
Because she heard what she wanted to hear
To avoid a spoiler-formatting "hell", this post contains unprotected spoiler information
In Crimes of Grindelwald
Queenie
join forces with Grindelwald at the end.
As others have suggested before, Queenie was in love with a Non-Wizard and by the standards of the late 20's Wizarding Society, marrying between Muggles and Wizards was considered a taboo; maybe it was also forbidden.
Quoting a dialogue from the movie,
JACOB: Okay, wait. We talked about this, like, a million times. If we get married and they find out, they’re gonna throw you in jail, sweetheart. I can’t have that. They don’t like people like me marrying people like you. I ain’t a wizard. I’m just me.
-Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Script
For this sole reason, at the beginning of the movie, she left him and throughout it, she seemed to be deeply affected by her choice. Later, when she met Grindelwald in Paris, she surrendered all her defenses. She heard what she wanted to hear. Of a world that she can leave freely without the "limitations" of the past.
Grindelwald, after all, is mentioned to have been an extremely charismatic man, who not only persuaded thousands to join him, but persuaded none other than Albus Dumbledore himself in his quest to rule Muggles for the Greater Good. If Albus Dumbledore was deceived that easy, what chances did poor Queenie had?
The real question would be why Grindelwald was so hesitant in making her join him. For that I guess, we will have to wait to find out.
answered Nov 21 '18 at 8:29
Lefteris008Lefteris008
2,006826
add a comment |
Because she heard what she wanted to hear
To avoid a spoiler-formatting "hell", this post contains unprotected spoiler information
In Crimes of Grindelwald
Queenie
join forces with Grindelwald at the end.
As others have suggested before, Queenie was in love with a Non-Wizard and by the standards of the late 20's Wizarding Society, marrying between Muggles and Wizards was considered a taboo; maybe it was also forbidden.
Quoting a dialogue from the movie,
JACOB: Okay, wait. We talked about this, like, a million times. If we get married and they find out, they’re gonna throw you in jail, sweetheart. I can’t have that. They don’t like people like me marrying people like you. I ain’t a wizard. I’m just me.
-Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Script
For this sole reason, at the beginning of the movie, she left him and throughout it, she seemed to be deeply affected by her choice. Later, when she met Grindelwald in Paris, she surrendered all her defenses. She heard what she wanted to hear. Of a world that she can leave freely without the "limitations" of the past.
Grindelwald, after all, is mentioned to have been an extremely charismatic man, who not only persuaded thousands to join him, but persuaded none other than Albus Dumbledore himself in his quest to rule Muggles for the Greater Good. If Albus Dumbledore was deceived that easy, what chances did poor Queenie had?
The real question would be why Grindelwald was so hesitant in making her join him. For that I guess, we will have to wait to find out.
answered Nov 21 '18 at 8:29
Lefteris008Lefteris008
2,006826
Because she heard what she wanted to hear
To avoid a spoiler-formatting "hell", this post contains unprotected spoiler information
In Crimes of Grindelwald
Queenie
join forces with Grindelwald at the end.
As others have suggested before, Queenie was in love with a Non-Wizard and by the standards of the late 20's Wizarding Society, marrying between Muggles and Wizards was considered a taboo; maybe it was also forbidden.
Quoting a dialogue from the movie,
JACOB: Okay, wait. We talked about this, like, a million times. If we get married and they find out, they’re gonna throw you in jail, sweetheart. I can’t have that. They don’t like people like me marrying people like you. I ain’t a wizard. I’m just me.
-Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Script
For this sole reason, at the beginning of the movie, she left him and throughout it, she seemed to be deeply affected by her choice. Later, when she met Grindelwald in Paris, she surrendered all her defenses. She heard what she wanted to hear. Of a world that she can leave freely without the "limitations" of the past.
Grindelwald, after all, is mentioned to have been an extremely charismatic man, who not only persuaded thousands to join him, but persuaded none other than Albus Dumbledore himself in his quest to rule Muggles for the Greater Good. If Albus Dumbledore was deceived that easy, what chances did poor Queenie had?
The real question would be why Grindelwald was so hesitant in making her join him. For that I guess, we will have to wait to find out.
answered Nov 21 '18 at 8:29
Lefteris008Lefteris008
2,006826
answered Nov 21 '18 at 8:29
Lefteris008Lefteris008
2,006826
answered Nov 21 '18 at 8:29
Lefteris008Lefteris008
2,006826
answered Nov 21 '18 at 8:29
Lefteris008Lefteris008
2,006826
2,006826
add a comment |
add a comment |
It’s unclear exactly but it would appear to be either because Grindelwald persuaded or enchanted her. I’ll detail reasons for both below:
Both
Grindelwald is described as being very persuasive and having a silver tongue. This could be a reason to say he is either very persuasive or is enchanting people.
PICQUERY It was necessary. He’s extremely powerful. We’ve had to change his guard three times—he’s very... persuasive. So we removed his tongue.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
SPIELMAN No more silver tongue, eh?
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
Persuasion
Grindelwald appears to have persuaded Abernathy to join his cause, this shows how persuasive he is and lays some foreshadowing down for persuasion, like he does to Credence at the end of the film too.
GRINDELWALD appears at the door and nods to ABERNATHY. He throws the door open so the water pours out—along with the two remaining AURORS. GRINDELWALD clambers inside and retrieves the vial from ABERNATHY’S mouth by the chain, casting a spell that grants ABERNATHY a new forked tongue.
GRINDELWALD You have joined a noble cause, my friend.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
NAGINI grabs CREDENCE and tries to drag him away with her, but he is staring at GRINDELWALD.
CREDENCE He knows who I am.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
Like with Credence, Grindelwald says what Queenie wants to hear to get her to join him. Here he picks at her wanting to marry Jacob, a Muggle, which is currently illegal.
QUEENIE Oh well, you know, she found out about Jacob and I seeing each other and she didn’t like it, ’cause of the “law.” (miming quotation marks) Not allowed to date No-Majs, not allowed to marry them. Blah, blah, blah. Well, she was all in a tizzy anyway, ’cause of you.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
GRINDELWALD I would never see you harmed, ever. It is not your fault that your sister is an Auror. I wish you were working with me now towards a world where we wizards are free to live openly, and to love freely.
GRINDELWALD’S hand touches her wand-tip and lowers it.
GRINDELWALD You are an innocent. So go now. Leave this place.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
QUEENIE (a decision) Jacob, he’s the answer. He wants what we want.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
Enchanted
Of course earlier on we have the foreshadowing of people being enchanted when Queenie has enchanted Jacob.
NEWT (V.O.) (speaking telepathically) You’ve enchanted him, haven’t you?
QUEENIE (reading his mind) What? I have not.
NEWT Will you stop reading my mind speaking telepathically) Queenie, you’ve brought him here against his will.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
It would also appear that Jacob believes she is enchanted, however, this could just be in desperation.
ANGLE ON QUEENIE AND JACOB, who are pressed up against a different stretch of wall.
JACOB Queenie. You gotta wake up.
QUEENIE (a decision) Jacob, he’s the answer. He wants what we want.
JACOB No, no, no, no, no, no.
QUEENIE Yeah.
JACOB No.
[...]
ANGLE ON QUEENIE AND JACOB.
QUEENIE Walk with me.
JACOB Honey, no!
QUEENIE (screams) Walk with me!
JACOB You’re crazy.
She reads his mind, turns, hesitates, then walks into the black fire.
JACOB (desperate, disbelieving) No! Queenie, don’t do it!”
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
answered Nov 20 '18 at 21:17
TheLethalCarrotTheLethalCarrot
47.2k17250298
3
I was under the impression that they showed Jacob 'enchanted' (and basically drunk) in order to show that Queenie had been legitimately convinced without magical involvement
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 21:20
@Valorum I suppose like a lot of the stuff it can be interpreted both ways.
– TheLethalCarrot
Nov 20 '18 at 21:21
add a comment |
It’s unclear exactly but it would appear to be either because Grindelwald persuaded or enchanted her. I’ll detail reasons for both below:
Both
Grindelwald is described as being very persuasive and having a silver tongue. This could be a reason to say he is either very persuasive or is enchanting people.
PICQUERY It was necessary. He’s extremely powerful. We’ve had to change his guard three times—he’s very... persuasive. So we removed his tongue.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
SPIELMAN No more silver tongue, eh?
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
Persuasion
Grindelwald appears to have persuaded Abernathy to join his cause, this shows how persuasive he is and lays some foreshadowing down for persuasion, like he does to Credence at the end of the film too.
GRINDELWALD appears at the door and nods to ABERNATHY. He throws the door open so the water pours out—along with the two remaining AURORS. GRINDELWALD clambers inside and retrieves the vial from ABERNATHY’S mouth by the chain, casting a spell that grants ABERNATHY a new forked tongue.
GRINDELWALD You have joined a noble cause, my friend.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
NAGINI grabs CREDENCE and tries to drag him away with her, but he is staring at GRINDELWALD.
CREDENCE He knows who I am.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
Like with Credence, Grindelwald says what Queenie wants to hear to get her to join him. Here he picks at her wanting to marry Jacob, a Muggle, which is currently illegal.
QUEENIE Oh well, you know, she found out about Jacob and I seeing each other and she didn’t like it, ’cause of the “law.” (miming quotation marks) Not allowed to date No-Majs, not allowed to marry them. Blah, blah, blah. Well, she was all in a tizzy anyway, ’cause of you.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
GRINDELWALD I would never see you harmed, ever. It is not your fault that your sister is an Auror. I wish you were working with me now towards a world where we wizards are free to live openly, and to love freely.
GRINDELWALD’S hand touches her wand-tip and lowers it.
GRINDELWALD You are an innocent. So go now. Leave this place.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
QUEENIE (a decision) Jacob, he’s the answer. He wants what we want.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
Enchanted
Of course earlier on we have the foreshadowing of people being enchanted when Queenie has enchanted Jacob.
NEWT (V.O.) (speaking telepathically) You’ve enchanted him, haven’t you?
QUEENIE (reading his mind) What? I have not.
NEWT Will you stop reading my mind speaking telepathically) Queenie, you’ve brought him here against his will.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
It would also appear that Jacob believes she is enchanted, however, this could just be in desperation.
ANGLE ON QUEENIE AND JACOB, who are pressed up against a different stretch of wall.
JACOB Queenie. You gotta wake up.
QUEENIE (a decision) Jacob, he’s the answer. He wants what we want.
JACOB No, no, no, no, no, no.
QUEENIE Yeah.
JACOB No.
[...]
ANGLE ON QUEENIE AND JACOB.
QUEENIE Walk with me.
JACOB Honey, no!
QUEENIE (screams) Walk with me!
JACOB You’re crazy.
She reads his mind, turns, hesitates, then walks into the black fire.
JACOB (desperate, disbelieving) No! Queenie, don’t do it!”
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
answered Nov 20 '18 at 21:17
TheLethalCarrotTheLethalCarrot
47.2k17250298
3
I was under the impression that they showed Jacob 'enchanted' (and basically drunk) in order to show that Queenie had been legitimately convinced without magical involvement
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 21:20
@Valorum I suppose like a lot of the stuff it can be interpreted both ways.
– TheLethalCarrot
Nov 20 '18 at 21:21
add a comment |
It’s unclear exactly but it would appear to be either because Grindelwald persuaded or enchanted her. I’ll detail reasons for both below:
Both
Grindelwald is described as being very persuasive and having a silver tongue. This could be a reason to say he is either very persuasive or is enchanting people.
PICQUERY It was necessary. He’s extremely powerful. We’ve had to change his guard three times—he’s very... persuasive. So we removed his tongue.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
SPIELMAN No more silver tongue, eh?
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
Persuasion
Grindelwald appears to have persuaded Abernathy to join his cause, this shows how persuasive he is and lays some foreshadowing down for persuasion, like he does to Credence at the end of the film too.
GRINDELWALD appears at the door and nods to ABERNATHY. He throws the door open so the water pours out—along with the two remaining AURORS. GRINDELWALD clambers inside and retrieves the vial from ABERNATHY’S mouth by the chain, casting a spell that grants ABERNATHY a new forked tongue.
GRINDELWALD You have joined a noble cause, my friend.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
NAGINI grabs CREDENCE and tries to drag him away with her, but he is staring at GRINDELWALD.
CREDENCE He knows who I am.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
Like with Credence, Grindelwald says what Queenie wants to hear to get her to join him. Here he picks at her wanting to marry Jacob, a Muggle, which is currently illegal.
QUEENIE Oh well, you know, she found out about Jacob and I seeing each other and she didn’t like it, ’cause of the “law.” (miming quotation marks) Not allowed to date No-Majs, not allowed to marry them. Blah, blah, blah. Well, she was all in a tizzy anyway, ’cause of you.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
GRINDELWALD I would never see you harmed, ever. It is not your fault that your sister is an Auror. I wish you were working with me now towards a world where we wizards are free to live openly, and to love freely.
GRINDELWALD’S hand touches her wand-tip and lowers it.
GRINDELWALD You are an innocent. So go now. Leave this place.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
QUEENIE (a decision) Jacob, he’s the answer. He wants what we want.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
Enchanted
Of course earlier on we have the foreshadowing of people being enchanted when Queenie has enchanted Jacob.
NEWT (V.O.) (speaking telepathically) You’ve enchanted him, haven’t you?
QUEENIE (reading his mind) What? I have not.
NEWT Will you stop reading my mind speaking telepathically) Queenie, you’ve brought him here against his will.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
It would also appear that Jacob believes she is enchanted, however, this could just be in desperation.
ANGLE ON QUEENIE AND JACOB, who are pressed up against a different stretch of wall.
JACOB Queenie. You gotta wake up.
QUEENIE (a decision) Jacob, he’s the answer. He wants what we want.
JACOB No, no, no, no, no, no.
QUEENIE Yeah.
JACOB No.
[...]
ANGLE ON QUEENIE AND JACOB.
QUEENIE Walk with me.
JACOB Honey, no!
QUEENIE (screams) Walk with me!
JACOB You’re crazy.
She reads his mind, turns, hesitates, then walks into the black fire.
JACOB (desperate, disbelieving) No! Queenie, don’t do it!”
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
answered Nov 20 '18 at 21:17
TheLethalCarrotTheLethalCarrot
47.2k17250298
It’s unclear exactly but it would appear to be either because Grindelwald persuaded or enchanted her. I’ll detail reasons for both below:
Both
Grindelwald is described as being very persuasive and having a silver tongue. This could be a reason to say he is either very persuasive or is enchanting people.
PICQUERY It was necessary. He’s extremely powerful. We’ve had to change his guard three times—he’s very... persuasive. So we removed his tongue.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
SPIELMAN No more silver tongue, eh?
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
Persuasion
Grindelwald appears to have persuaded Abernathy to join his cause, this shows how persuasive he is and lays some foreshadowing down for persuasion, like he does to Credence at the end of the film too.
GRINDELWALD appears at the door and nods to ABERNATHY. He throws the door open so the water pours out—along with the two remaining AURORS. GRINDELWALD clambers inside and retrieves the vial from ABERNATHY’S mouth by the chain, casting a spell that grants ABERNATHY a new forked tongue.
GRINDELWALD You have joined a noble cause, my friend.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
NAGINI grabs CREDENCE and tries to drag him away with her, but he is staring at GRINDELWALD.
CREDENCE He knows who I am.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
Like with Credence, Grindelwald says what Queenie wants to hear to get her to join him. Here he picks at her wanting to marry Jacob, a Muggle, which is currently illegal.
QUEENIE Oh well, you know, she found out about Jacob and I seeing each other and she didn’t like it, ’cause of the “law.” (miming quotation marks) Not allowed to date No-Majs, not allowed to marry them. Blah, blah, blah. Well, she was all in a tizzy anyway, ’cause of you.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
GRINDELWALD I would never see you harmed, ever. It is not your fault that your sister is an Auror. I wish you were working with me now towards a world where we wizards are free to live openly, and to love freely.
GRINDELWALD’S hand touches her wand-tip and lowers it.
GRINDELWALD You are an innocent. So go now. Leave this place.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
QUEENIE (a decision) Jacob, he’s the answer. He wants what we want.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
Enchanted
Of course earlier on we have the foreshadowing of people being enchanted when Queenie has enchanted Jacob.
NEWT (V.O.) (speaking telepathically) You’ve enchanted him, haven’t you?
QUEENIE (reading his mind) What? I have not.
NEWT Will you stop reading my mind speaking telepathically) Queenie, you’ve brought him here against his will.
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
It would also appear that Jacob believes she is enchanted, however, this could just be in desperation.
ANGLE ON QUEENIE AND JACOB, who are pressed up against a different stretch of wall.
JACOB Queenie. You gotta wake up.
QUEENIE (a decision) Jacob, he’s the answer. He wants what we want.
JACOB No, no, no, no, no, no.
QUEENIE Yeah.
JACOB No.
[...]
ANGLE ON QUEENIE AND JACOB.
QUEENIE Walk with me.
JACOB Honey, no!
QUEENIE (screams) Walk with me!
JACOB You’re crazy.
She reads his mind, turns, hesitates, then walks into the black fire.
JACOB (desperate, disbelieving) No! Queenie, don’t do it!”
Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald - The Original Screenplay
answered Nov 20 '18 at 21:17
TheLethalCarrotTheLethalCarrot
47.2k17250298
edited Nov 21 '18 at 9:10
answered Nov 20 '18 at 21:17
TheLethalCarrotTheLethalCarrot
47.2k17250298
answered Nov 20 '18 at 21:17
TheLethalCarrotTheLethalCarrot
47.2k17250298
answered Nov 20 '18 at 21:17
TheLethalCarrotTheLethalCarrot
47.2k17250298
47.2k17250298
3
I was under the impression that they showed Jacob 'enchanted' (and basically drunk) in order to show that Queenie had been legitimately convinced without magical involvement
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 21:20
@Valorum I suppose like a lot of the stuff it can be interpreted both ways.
– TheLethalCarrot
Nov 20 '18 at 21:21
add a comment |
3
I was under the impression that they showed Jacob 'enchanted' (and basically drunk) in order to show that Queenie had been legitimately convinced without magical involvement
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 21:20
@Valorum I suppose like a lot of the stuff it can be interpreted both ways.
– TheLethalCarrot
Nov 20 '18 at 21:21
3
3
I was under the impression that they showed Jacob 'enchanted' (and basically drunk) in order to show that Queenie had been legitimately convinced without magical involvement
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 21:20
I was under the impression that they showed Jacob 'enchanted' (and basically drunk) in order to show that Queenie had been legitimately convinced without magical involvement
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 21:20
@Valorum I suppose like a lot of the stuff it can be interpreted both ways.
– TheLethalCarrot
Nov 20 '18 at 21:21
@Valorum I suppose like a lot of the stuff it can be interpreted both ways.
– TheLethalCarrot
Nov 20 '18 at 21:21
add a comment |
This is just my opinion. Think about what time period we're talking about. It's the 1920s. If Queenie were perhaps pregnant, that would explain her despair on the streets of Paris, her frustration at Jacob refusing to marry her and her feeling like she didn't matter. Women in pre 1970s were treated horribly if they were pregnant without being married and Queenie finds herself wanting to marry a man she would be imprisoned for dating, let alone having a child with. She cannot go back to America and Jacob won't marry her for fear she'll get in trouble. That makes her motivation more understandable at least to me.
answered 2 days ago
Cathy SolowayCathy Soloway
11
New contributor
Cathy Soloway is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
1
Is there any reason to assume that this is the case, or is it merely your own personal headcanon?
– Valorum
2 days ago
1
Welcome to the site! I have not seen the new film as of yet, but if you could provide some reasons and/or examples from the film or book that support your opinion it would make your answer much better. We try to stick as close to facts as possible on this (and the other stack exchange) sites. Sometimes opinion is unavoidable or enlightening, but without providing examples you are unlikely to get any support for your theory.
– Odin1806
2 days ago
add a comment |
This is just my opinion. Think about what time period we're talking about. It's the 1920s. If Queenie were perhaps pregnant, that would explain her despair on the streets of Paris, her frustration at Jacob refusing to marry her and her feeling like she didn't matter. Women in pre 1970s were treated horribly if they were pregnant without being married and Queenie finds herself wanting to marry a man she would be imprisoned for dating, let alone having a child with. She cannot go back to America and Jacob won't marry her for fear she'll get in trouble. That makes her motivation more understandable at least to me.
answered 2 days ago
Cathy SolowayCathy Soloway
11
New contributor
Cathy Soloway is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
1
Is there any reason to assume that this is the case, or is it merely your own personal headcanon?
– Valorum
2 days ago
1
Welcome to the site! I have not seen the new film as of yet, but if you could provide some reasons and/or examples from the film or book that support your opinion it would make your answer much better. We try to stick as close to facts as possible on this (and the other stack exchange) sites. Sometimes opinion is unavoidable or enlightening, but without providing examples you are unlikely to get any support for your theory.
– Odin1806
2 days ago
add a comment |
This is just my opinion. Think about what time period we're talking about. It's the 1920s. If Queenie were perhaps pregnant, that would explain her despair on the streets of Paris, her frustration at Jacob refusing to marry her and her feeling like she didn't matter. Women in pre 1970s were treated horribly if they were pregnant without being married and Queenie finds herself wanting to marry a man she would be imprisoned for dating, let alone having a child with. She cannot go back to America and Jacob won't marry her for fear she'll get in trouble. That makes her motivation more understandable at least to me.
answered 2 days ago
Cathy SolowayCathy Soloway
11
New contributor
Cathy Soloway is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
This is just my opinion. Think about what time period we're talking about. It's the 1920s. If Queenie were perhaps pregnant, that would explain her despair on the streets of Paris, her frustration at Jacob refusing to marry her and her feeling like she didn't matter. Women in pre 1970s were treated horribly if they were pregnant without being married and Queenie finds herself wanting to marry a man she would be imprisoned for dating, let alone having a child with. She cannot go back to America and Jacob won't marry her for fear she'll get in trouble. That makes her motivation more understandable at least to me.
answered 2 days ago
Cathy SolowayCathy Soloway
11
New contributor
Cathy Soloway is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
answered 2 days ago
Cathy SolowayCathy Soloway
11
New contributor
Cathy Soloway is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
answered 2 days ago
Cathy SolowayCathy Soloway
11
answered 2 days ago
Cathy SolowayCathy Soloway
11
11
New contributor
Cathy Soloway is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
New contributor
Cathy Soloway is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
Cathy Soloway is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
1
Is there any reason to assume that this is the case, or is it merely your own personal headcanon?
– Valorum
2 days ago
1
Welcome to the site! I have not seen the new film as of yet, but if you could provide some reasons and/or examples from the film or book that support your opinion it would make your answer much better. We try to stick as close to facts as possible on this (and the other stack exchange) sites. Sometimes opinion is unavoidable or enlightening, but without providing examples you are unlikely to get any support for your theory.
– Odin1806
2 days ago
add a comment |
1
Is there any reason to assume that this is the case, or is it merely your own personal headcanon?
– Valorum
2 days ago
1
Welcome to the site! I have not seen the new film as of yet, but if you could provide some reasons and/or examples from the film or book that support your opinion it would make your answer much better. We try to stick as close to facts as possible on this (and the other stack exchange) sites. Sometimes opinion is unavoidable or enlightening, but without providing examples you are unlikely to get any support for your theory.
– Odin1806
2 days ago
1
1
Is there any reason to assume that this is the case, or is it merely your own personal headcanon?
– Valorum
2 days ago
Is there any reason to assume that this is the case, or is it merely your own personal headcanon?
– Valorum
2 days ago
1
1
Welcome to the site! I have not seen the new film as of yet, but if you could provide some reasons and/or examples from the film or book that support your opinion it would make your answer much better. We try to stick as close to facts as possible on this (and the other stack exchange) sites. Sometimes opinion is unavoidable or enlightening, but without providing examples you are unlikely to get any support for your theory.
– Odin1806
2 days ago
Welcome to the site! I have not seen the new film as of yet, but if you could provide some reasons and/or examples from the film or book that support your opinion it would make your answer much better. We try to stick as close to facts as possible on this (and the other stack exchange) sites. Sometimes opinion is unavoidable or enlightening, but without providing examples you are unlikely to get any support for your theory.
– Odin1806
2 days ago
add a comment |
Thanks for contributing an answer to Science Fiction & Fantasy Stack Exchange!
- Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!
But avoid …
- Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.
- Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.
To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fscifi.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f198993%2fwhy-did-this-character-join-grindelwald%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
3
I had this discussion with someone the other day, I was unable to come to a conclusion as to whether she was persuaded or Grindelwald had enchanted her.
– TheLethalCarrot
Nov 20 '18 at 20:43
@TheLethalCarrot I also thought she was enchanted (it would be appropriate turnabout for her actions earlier), but why would G want to enchant her specifically?
– Azor Ahai
Nov 20 '18 at 20:44
6
@TheLethalCarrot - She's an incredibly gifted witch with a power of legilimency unlike any we've seen. She would be an enormous asset to any rebellion
– Valorum
Nov 20 '18 at 20:45
1
Her relationship is precisely what makes her more likely to join than your average witch in the street.
– Janus Bahs Jacquet
Nov 20 '18 at 22:31
3
@AzorAhai If I recall correctly, Grindelwald discovered she was a natural Legilimens in the first movie. This skill proves useful almost immediately after she joins him, when she is able to read Credence's mind and provide useful emotional information to Grindelwald. I find the notion that he bewitched her in some way far more convincing than her deciding to join with the darkest wizard of all time in the span of a single day.
– TylerH
Nov 21 '18 at 14:49