Why was the Captain of Cathay Pacific flight 780 not able to shut down engine 1 and land with a more...
$begingroup$
In the approach phase, engine 1 of Cathay Pacific flight 780 got stuck at about 70% N1 and it forced the crew to do an overspeed landing (230knots).
Why didn't they shut it off by turning the fuel pumps off? Is there a backup mechanism if the fuel valve fails like in this scenario?
safety jet-engine accident-investigation fuel-systems airbus-a330
edited 21 mins ago
psmears
25914
asked 5 hours ago
xMoooxMooo
211
New contributor
xMooo is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
In the approach phase, engine 1 of Cathay Pacific flight 780 got stuck at about 70% N1 and it forced the crew to do an overspeed landing (230knots).
Why didn't they shut it off by turning the fuel pumps off? Is there a backup mechanism if the fuel valve fails like in this scenario?
safety jet-engine accident-investigation fuel-systems airbus-a330
edited 21 mins ago
psmears
25914
asked 5 hours ago
xMoooxMooo
211
New contributor
xMooo is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
In the approach phase, engine 1 of Cathay Pacific flight 780 got stuck at about 70% N1 and it forced the crew to do an overspeed landing (230knots).
Why didn't they shut it off by turning the fuel pumps off? Is there a backup mechanism if the fuel valve fails like in this scenario?
safety jet-engine accident-investigation fuel-systems airbus-a330
edited 21 mins ago
psmears
25914
asked 5 hours ago
xMoooxMooo
211
New contributor
xMooo is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
$endgroup$
In the approach phase, engine 1 of Cathay Pacific flight 780 got stuck at about 70% N1 and it forced the crew to do an overspeed landing (230knots).
Why didn't they shut it off by turning the fuel pumps off? Is there a backup mechanism if the fuel valve fails like in this scenario?
safety jet-engine accident-investigation fuel-systems airbus-a330
safety jet-engine accident-investigation fuel-systems airbus-a330
edited 21 mins ago
psmears
25914
asked 5 hours ago
xMoooxMooo
211
New contributor
xMooo is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
edited 21 mins ago
psmears
25914
asked 5 hours ago
xMoooxMooo
211
New contributor
xMooo is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
edited 21 mins ago
psmears
25914
edited 21 mins ago
psmears
25914
edited 21 mins ago
psmears
25914
25914
asked 5 hours ago
xMoooxMooo
211
New contributor
xMooo is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
asked 5 hours ago
xMoooxMooo
211
asked 5 hours ago
xMoooxMooo
211
211
New contributor
xMooo is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
New contributor
xMooo is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
xMooo is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
add a comment |
add a comment |
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
You can find the full incident report here and this topic is touched upon briefly, but in short they had little to no time to entertain any other options but a full speed landing.
It was not until the aircraft [was] on the final descent for landing that
the Commander realised they could not reduce the thrust on the number
1 engine. The speed was not controllable and from that point, there
was no time for the crew to consider other strategy nor procedure to
cope with such emergency situation.
and more in the conclusion section...
t. At that stage, there was no time for the flight crew to consider other
strategy nor procedure to cope with such emergency situation. The
flight crew concentrated on flying the aircraft for a safe landing.
First off, the engine was throwing errors throughout the flight and they were talking to the maintenance team at other points. Ultimately, the proper steps were taken and everything was done by the book. They were prepared for an engine-out landing. When you have a runaway engine malfunction (or throttle stuck at full) shutting down prior to landing may not be the right decision if the running engine provides no immediate safety risk. If you shut down a problematic engine in flight you run the serious risk of not being able to get it started again.
Considering that most airports have a bit (or a lot) of extra runway, EMAS systems and often land at the end of the runway, coming in overspeed and burning through your tires and brakes may be safer than cutting the engine and potentially falling short of the runway.
edited 5 mins ago
CJ Dennis
1073
answered 4 hours ago
DaveDave
62.8k4112229
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Well I suppose you could establish glide distance to landing and cut fuel to the engine.
$endgroup$
– Joshua
1 hour ago
1
$begingroup$
Regarding the last paragraph... Any landing you can walk away from, and all that, huh?
$endgroup$
– T.J.L.
1 hour ago
add a comment |
Your Answer
StackExchange.ifUsing("editor", function () {
return StackExchange.using("mathjaxEditing", function () {
StackExchange.MarkdownEditor.creationCallbacks.add(function (editor, postfix) {
StackExchange.mathjaxEditing.prepareWmdForMathJax(editor, postfix, [["$", "$"], ["\\(","\\)"]]);
});
});
}, "mathjax-editing");
StackExchange.ready(function() {
var channelOptions = {
tags: "".split(" "),
id: "528"
};
initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);
StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function() {
// Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled) {
StackExchange.using("snippets", function() {
createEditor();
});
}
else {
createEditor();
}
});
function createEditor() {
StackExchange.prepareEditor({
heartbeatType: 'answer',
autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
convertImagesToLinks: false,
noModals: true,
showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
reputationToPostImages: null,
bindNavPrevention: true,
postfix: "",
imageUploader: {
brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
allowUrls: true
},
noCode: true, onDemand: true,
discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
});
}
});
xMooo is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2faviation.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f59303%2fwhy-was-the-captain-of-cathay-pacific-flight-780-not-able-to-shut-down-engine-1%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
You can find the full incident report here and this topic is touched upon briefly, but in short they had little to no time to entertain any other options but a full speed landing.
It was not until the aircraft [was] on the final descent for landing that
the Commander realised they could not reduce the thrust on the number
1 engine. The speed was not controllable and from that point, there
was no time for the crew to consider other strategy nor procedure to
cope with such emergency situation.
and more in the conclusion section...
t. At that stage, there was no time for the flight crew to consider other
strategy nor procedure to cope with such emergency situation. The
flight crew concentrated on flying the aircraft for a safe landing.
First off, the engine was throwing errors throughout the flight and they were talking to the maintenance team at other points. Ultimately, the proper steps were taken and everything was done by the book. They were prepared for an engine-out landing. When you have a runaway engine malfunction (or throttle stuck at full) shutting down prior to landing may not be the right decision if the running engine provides no immediate safety risk. If you shut down a problematic engine in flight you run the serious risk of not being able to get it started again.
Considering that most airports have a bit (or a lot) of extra runway, EMAS systems and often land at the end of the runway, coming in overspeed and burning through your tires and brakes may be safer than cutting the engine and potentially falling short of the runway.
edited 5 mins ago
CJ Dennis
1073
answered 4 hours ago
DaveDave
62.8k4112229
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Well I suppose you could establish glide distance to landing and cut fuel to the engine.
$endgroup$
– Joshua
1 hour ago
1
$begingroup$
Regarding the last paragraph... Any landing you can walk away from, and all that, huh?
$endgroup$
– T.J.L.
1 hour ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You can find the full incident report here and this topic is touched upon briefly, but in short they had little to no time to entertain any other options but a full speed landing.
It was not until the aircraft [was] on the final descent for landing that
the Commander realised they could not reduce the thrust on the number
1 engine. The speed was not controllable and from that point, there
was no time for the crew to consider other strategy nor procedure to
cope with such emergency situation.
and more in the conclusion section...
t. At that stage, there was no time for the flight crew to consider other
strategy nor procedure to cope with such emergency situation. The
flight crew concentrated on flying the aircraft for a safe landing.
First off, the engine was throwing errors throughout the flight and they were talking to the maintenance team at other points. Ultimately, the proper steps were taken and everything was done by the book. They were prepared for an engine-out landing. When you have a runaway engine malfunction (or throttle stuck at full) shutting down prior to landing may not be the right decision if the running engine provides no immediate safety risk. If you shut down a problematic engine in flight you run the serious risk of not being able to get it started again.
Considering that most airports have a bit (or a lot) of extra runway, EMAS systems and often land at the end of the runway, coming in overspeed and burning through your tires and brakes may be safer than cutting the engine and potentially falling short of the runway.
edited 5 mins ago
CJ Dennis
1073
answered 4 hours ago
DaveDave
62.8k4112229
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Well I suppose you could establish glide distance to landing and cut fuel to the engine.
$endgroup$
– Joshua
1 hour ago
1
$begingroup$
Regarding the last paragraph... Any landing you can walk away from, and all that, huh?
$endgroup$
– T.J.L.
1 hour ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You can find the full incident report here and this topic is touched upon briefly, but in short they had little to no time to entertain any other options but a full speed landing.
It was not until the aircraft [was] on the final descent for landing that
the Commander realised they could not reduce the thrust on the number
1 engine. The speed was not controllable and from that point, there
was no time for the crew to consider other strategy nor procedure to
cope with such emergency situation.
and more in the conclusion section...
t. At that stage, there was no time for the flight crew to consider other
strategy nor procedure to cope with such emergency situation. The
flight crew concentrated on flying the aircraft for a safe landing.
First off, the engine was throwing errors throughout the flight and they were talking to the maintenance team at other points. Ultimately, the proper steps were taken and everything was done by the book. They were prepared for an engine-out landing. When you have a runaway engine malfunction (or throttle stuck at full) shutting down prior to landing may not be the right decision if the running engine provides no immediate safety risk. If you shut down a problematic engine in flight you run the serious risk of not being able to get it started again.
Considering that most airports have a bit (or a lot) of extra runway, EMAS systems and often land at the end of the runway, coming in overspeed and burning through your tires and brakes may be safer than cutting the engine and potentially falling short of the runway.
edited 5 mins ago
CJ Dennis
1073
answered 4 hours ago
DaveDave
62.8k4112229
$endgroup$
You can find the full incident report here and this topic is touched upon briefly, but in short they had little to no time to entertain any other options but a full speed landing.
It was not until the aircraft [was] on the final descent for landing that
the Commander realised they could not reduce the thrust on the number
1 engine. The speed was not controllable and from that point, there
was no time for the crew to consider other strategy nor procedure to
cope with such emergency situation.
and more in the conclusion section...
t. At that stage, there was no time for the flight crew to consider other
strategy nor procedure to cope with such emergency situation. The
flight crew concentrated on flying the aircraft for a safe landing.
First off, the engine was throwing errors throughout the flight and they were talking to the maintenance team at other points. Ultimately, the proper steps were taken and everything was done by the book. They were prepared for an engine-out landing. When you have a runaway engine malfunction (or throttle stuck at full) shutting down prior to landing may not be the right decision if the running engine provides no immediate safety risk. If you shut down a problematic engine in flight you run the serious risk of not being able to get it started again.
Considering that most airports have a bit (or a lot) of extra runway, EMAS systems and often land at the end of the runway, coming in overspeed and burning through your tires and brakes may be safer than cutting the engine and potentially falling short of the runway.
edited 5 mins ago
CJ Dennis
1073
answered 4 hours ago
DaveDave
62.8k4112229
edited 5 mins ago
CJ Dennis
1073
edited 5 mins ago
CJ Dennis
1073
edited 5 mins ago
CJ Dennis
1073
1073
answered 4 hours ago
DaveDave
62.8k4112229
answered 4 hours ago
DaveDave
62.8k4112229
answered 4 hours ago
DaveDave
62.8k4112229
62.8k4112229
$begingroup$
Well I suppose you could establish glide distance to landing and cut fuel to the engine.
$endgroup$
– Joshua
1 hour ago
1
$begingroup$
Regarding the last paragraph... Any landing you can walk away from, and all that, huh?
$endgroup$
– T.J.L.
1 hour ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Well I suppose you could establish glide distance to landing and cut fuel to the engine.
$endgroup$
– Joshua
1 hour ago
1
$begingroup$
Regarding the last paragraph... Any landing you can walk away from, and all that, huh?
$endgroup$
– T.J.L.
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
Well I suppose you could establish glide distance to landing and cut fuel to the engine.
$endgroup$
– Joshua
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
Well I suppose you could establish glide distance to landing and cut fuel to the engine.
$endgroup$
– Joshua
1 hour ago
1
1
$begingroup$
Regarding the last paragraph... Any landing you can walk away from, and all that, huh?
$endgroup$
– T.J.L.
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
Regarding the last paragraph... Any landing you can walk away from, and all that, huh?
$endgroup$
– T.J.L.
1 hour ago
add a comment |
xMooo is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
xMooo is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
xMooo is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
xMooo is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
Thanks for contributing an answer to Aviation Stack Exchange!
- Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!
But avoid …
- Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.
- Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.
Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.
To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2faviation.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f59303%2fwhy-was-the-captain-of-cathay-pacific-flight-780-not-able-to-shut-down-engine-1%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
