Why didn't Tar-Miriel leave with the faithful?
I mean surely she was still in contact with them; after all, she was faithful herself, wasn't she? Also there was a lot of time between Ar-Pharazon's Great Fleet and the Downfall of Numenor: approximately 36 days I believe it was. Yet she chose not to join them on the ships and tried to reach the top of Meneltarma (which was on fire at the time of the downfall). So why didn't she meet up with Elendil and the rest of her kinsmen?
tolkiens-legendarium the-silmarillion
edited Dec 2 '15 at 20:37
Jason Baker
142k34788702
asked Dec 2 '15 at 20:26
FingolfinFingolfin
4,73333190
add a comment |
I mean surely she was still in contact with them; after all, she was faithful herself, wasn't she? Also there was a lot of time between Ar-Pharazon's Great Fleet and the Downfall of Numenor: approximately 36 days I believe it was. Yet she chose not to join them on the ships and tried to reach the top of Meneltarma (which was on fire at the time of the downfall). So why didn't she meet up with Elendil and the rest of her kinsmen?
tolkiens-legendarium the-silmarillion
edited Dec 2 '15 at 20:37
Jason Baker
142k34788702
asked Dec 2 '15 at 20:26
FingolfinFingolfin
4,73333190
1
The Kingsmen probably stopped her from leaving since she was the wife of their King.
– user35326
Dec 2 '15 at 20:44
add a comment |
I mean surely she was still in contact with them; after all, she was faithful herself, wasn't she? Also there was a lot of time between Ar-Pharazon's Great Fleet and the Downfall of Numenor: approximately 36 days I believe it was. Yet she chose not to join them on the ships and tried to reach the top of Meneltarma (which was on fire at the time of the downfall). So why didn't she meet up with Elendil and the rest of her kinsmen?
tolkiens-legendarium the-silmarillion
edited Dec 2 '15 at 20:37
Jason Baker
142k34788702
asked Dec 2 '15 at 20:26
FingolfinFingolfin
4,73333190
I mean surely she was still in contact with them; after all, she was faithful herself, wasn't she? Also there was a lot of time between Ar-Pharazon's Great Fleet and the Downfall of Numenor: approximately 36 days I believe it was. Yet she chose not to join them on the ships and tried to reach the top of Meneltarma (which was on fire at the time of the downfall). So why didn't she meet up with Elendil and the rest of her kinsmen?
tolkiens-legendarium the-silmarillion
tolkiens-legendarium the-silmarillion
edited Dec 2 '15 at 20:37
Jason Baker
142k34788702
asked Dec 2 '15 at 20:26
FingolfinFingolfin
4,73333190
edited Dec 2 '15 at 20:37
Jason Baker
142k34788702
asked Dec 2 '15 at 20:26
FingolfinFingolfin
4,73333190
edited Dec 2 '15 at 20:37
Jason Baker
142k34788702
edited Dec 2 '15 at 20:37
Jason Baker
142k34788702
edited Dec 2 '15 at 20:37
Jason Baker
142k34788702
142k34788702
asked Dec 2 '15 at 20:26
FingolfinFingolfin
4,73333190
asked Dec 2 '15 at 20:26
FingolfinFingolfin
4,73333190
asked Dec 2 '15 at 20:26
FingolfinFingolfin
4,73333190
4,73333190
1
The Kingsmen probably stopped her from leaving since she was the wife of their King.
– user35326
Dec 2 '15 at 20:44
add a comment |
1
The Kingsmen probably stopped her from leaving since she was the wife of their King.
– user35326
Dec 2 '15 at 20:44
1
1
The Kingsmen probably stopped her from leaving since she was the wife of their King.
– user35326
Dec 2 '15 at 20:44
The Kingsmen probably stopped her from leaving since she was the wife of their King.
– user35326
Dec 2 '15 at 20:44
add a comment |
2 Answers
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Unknown
The most plausible explanation is that forces loyal to Sauron prevented her; we know that they tried to prevent Elendil from leaving:
Elendil had remained in Romenna, refusing the summons of the King when he set forth to war; and avoiding the soldiers of Sauron that came to seize him and drag him to the fires of the Temple, he went aboard his ship and stood off from the shore, waiting on the time.
The Silmarillion IV Akallabeth
Even if we suppose that Míriel was in contact with the Faithful, it would presumably have been difficult for her to leave the Palace to join them, especially since (given who her father was) she was almost certainly suspected of having sympathies with enemies of the state.
Finally, I'll point out that Tolkien's later writings cast doubt on the assumption that Míriel's loyalties were with the Faithful; some late scribbles introduce the idea that Míriel actually did love Ar-Pharazon, in which case she presumably stayed behind for personal reasons. Christopher Tolkien comments:
It is not perfectly clear to me how the textual puzzle presented by these writings is to be resolved, but I am inclined to think that, contrary to appearance, the texts (a), (b), and (c) in fact followed the writing of the long rider to the Akallabeth, and that they represent the emergence of a doubt in my father's mind whether the marriage of Pharazon and Zimrahil was indeed 'against her will', and the sketching of a new story on the subject.
History of Middle-earth XII The Peoples of Middle-earth Part One Chapter 5: "The History of the Akallabeth"
answered Dec 2 '15 at 20:34
Jason BakerJason Baker
142k34788702
Speculative - she may have been required to exercise governmental authority in the absence of the King; from this obligation she could not have held herself excused to join a (from a strictly legal point of view) separatist group.
– Matt Gutting
Dec 2 '15 at 20:50
add a comment |
Remembering that Tar Miriel was the Queen and therefore (notionally) in charge of affairs in Numenor, she probably felt that it was her duty to stay in Armenelos even if in her heart she wanted to leave. Her thought was probably; "The Queen does not desert her people."
answered 1 min ago
Jeremy LucasJeremy Lucas
1
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Jeremy Lucas is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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2 Answers
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2 Answers
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Unknown
The most plausible explanation is that forces loyal to Sauron prevented her; we know that they tried to prevent Elendil from leaving:
Elendil had remained in Romenna, refusing the summons of the King when he set forth to war; and avoiding the soldiers of Sauron that came to seize him and drag him to the fires of the Temple, he went aboard his ship and stood off from the shore, waiting on the time.
The Silmarillion IV Akallabeth
Even if we suppose that Míriel was in contact with the Faithful, it would presumably have been difficult for her to leave the Palace to join them, especially since (given who her father was) she was almost certainly suspected of having sympathies with enemies of the state.
Finally, I'll point out that Tolkien's later writings cast doubt on the assumption that Míriel's loyalties were with the Faithful; some late scribbles introduce the idea that Míriel actually did love Ar-Pharazon, in which case she presumably stayed behind for personal reasons. Christopher Tolkien comments:
It is not perfectly clear to me how the textual puzzle presented by these writings is to be resolved, but I am inclined to think that, contrary to appearance, the texts (a), (b), and (c) in fact followed the writing of the long rider to the Akallabeth, and that they represent the emergence of a doubt in my father's mind whether the marriage of Pharazon and Zimrahil was indeed 'against her will', and the sketching of a new story on the subject.
History of Middle-earth XII The Peoples of Middle-earth Part One Chapter 5: "The History of the Akallabeth"
answered Dec 2 '15 at 20:34
Jason BakerJason Baker
142k34788702
Speculative - she may have been required to exercise governmental authority in the absence of the King; from this obligation she could not have held herself excused to join a (from a strictly legal point of view) separatist group.
– Matt Gutting
Dec 2 '15 at 20:50
add a comment |
Unknown
The most plausible explanation is that forces loyal to Sauron prevented her; we know that they tried to prevent Elendil from leaving:
Elendil had remained in Romenna, refusing the summons of the King when he set forth to war; and avoiding the soldiers of Sauron that came to seize him and drag him to the fires of the Temple, he went aboard his ship and stood off from the shore, waiting on the time.
The Silmarillion IV Akallabeth
Even if we suppose that Míriel was in contact with the Faithful, it would presumably have been difficult for her to leave the Palace to join them, especially since (given who her father was) she was almost certainly suspected of having sympathies with enemies of the state.
Finally, I'll point out that Tolkien's later writings cast doubt on the assumption that Míriel's loyalties were with the Faithful; some late scribbles introduce the idea that Míriel actually did love Ar-Pharazon, in which case she presumably stayed behind for personal reasons. Christopher Tolkien comments:
It is not perfectly clear to me how the textual puzzle presented by these writings is to be resolved, but I am inclined to think that, contrary to appearance, the texts (a), (b), and (c) in fact followed the writing of the long rider to the Akallabeth, and that they represent the emergence of a doubt in my father's mind whether the marriage of Pharazon and Zimrahil was indeed 'against her will', and the sketching of a new story on the subject.
History of Middle-earth XII The Peoples of Middle-earth Part One Chapter 5: "The History of the Akallabeth"
answered Dec 2 '15 at 20:34
Jason BakerJason Baker
142k34788702
Speculative - she may have been required to exercise governmental authority in the absence of the King; from this obligation she could not have held herself excused to join a (from a strictly legal point of view) separatist group.
– Matt Gutting
Dec 2 '15 at 20:50
add a comment |
Unknown
The most plausible explanation is that forces loyal to Sauron prevented her; we know that they tried to prevent Elendil from leaving:
Elendil had remained in Romenna, refusing the summons of the King when he set forth to war; and avoiding the soldiers of Sauron that came to seize him and drag him to the fires of the Temple, he went aboard his ship and stood off from the shore, waiting on the time.
The Silmarillion IV Akallabeth
Even if we suppose that Míriel was in contact with the Faithful, it would presumably have been difficult for her to leave the Palace to join them, especially since (given who her father was) she was almost certainly suspected of having sympathies with enemies of the state.
Finally, I'll point out that Tolkien's later writings cast doubt on the assumption that Míriel's loyalties were with the Faithful; some late scribbles introduce the idea that Míriel actually did love Ar-Pharazon, in which case she presumably stayed behind for personal reasons. Christopher Tolkien comments:
It is not perfectly clear to me how the textual puzzle presented by these writings is to be resolved, but I am inclined to think that, contrary to appearance, the texts (a), (b), and (c) in fact followed the writing of the long rider to the Akallabeth, and that they represent the emergence of a doubt in my father's mind whether the marriage of Pharazon and Zimrahil was indeed 'against her will', and the sketching of a new story on the subject.
History of Middle-earth XII The Peoples of Middle-earth Part One Chapter 5: "The History of the Akallabeth"
answered Dec 2 '15 at 20:34
Jason BakerJason Baker
142k34788702
Unknown
The most plausible explanation is that forces loyal to Sauron prevented her; we know that they tried to prevent Elendil from leaving:
Elendil had remained in Romenna, refusing the summons of the King when he set forth to war; and avoiding the soldiers of Sauron that came to seize him and drag him to the fires of the Temple, he went aboard his ship and stood off from the shore, waiting on the time.
The Silmarillion IV Akallabeth
Even if we suppose that Míriel was in contact with the Faithful, it would presumably have been difficult for her to leave the Palace to join them, especially since (given who her father was) she was almost certainly suspected of having sympathies with enemies of the state.
Finally, I'll point out that Tolkien's later writings cast doubt on the assumption that Míriel's loyalties were with the Faithful; some late scribbles introduce the idea that Míriel actually did love Ar-Pharazon, in which case she presumably stayed behind for personal reasons. Christopher Tolkien comments:
It is not perfectly clear to me how the textual puzzle presented by these writings is to be resolved, but I am inclined to think that, contrary to appearance, the texts (a), (b), and (c) in fact followed the writing of the long rider to the Akallabeth, and that they represent the emergence of a doubt in my father's mind whether the marriage of Pharazon and Zimrahil was indeed 'against her will', and the sketching of a new story on the subject.
History of Middle-earth XII The Peoples of Middle-earth Part One Chapter 5: "The History of the Akallabeth"
answered Dec 2 '15 at 20:34
Jason BakerJason Baker
142k34788702
edited Dec 2 '15 at 20:52
answered Dec 2 '15 at 20:34
Jason BakerJason Baker
142k34788702
answered Dec 2 '15 at 20:34
Jason BakerJason Baker
142k34788702
answered Dec 2 '15 at 20:34
Jason BakerJason Baker
142k34788702
142k34788702
Speculative - she may have been required to exercise governmental authority in the absence of the King; from this obligation she could not have held herself excused to join a (from a strictly legal point of view) separatist group.
– Matt Gutting
Dec 2 '15 at 20:50
add a comment |
Speculative - she may have been required to exercise governmental authority in the absence of the King; from this obligation she could not have held herself excused to join a (from a strictly legal point of view) separatist group.
– Matt Gutting
Dec 2 '15 at 20:50
Speculative - she may have been required to exercise governmental authority in the absence of the King; from this obligation she could not have held herself excused to join a (from a strictly legal point of view) separatist group.
– Matt Gutting
Dec 2 '15 at 20:50
Speculative - she may have been required to exercise governmental authority in the absence of the King; from this obligation she could not have held herself excused to join a (from a strictly legal point of view) separatist group.
– Matt Gutting
Dec 2 '15 at 20:50
add a comment |
Remembering that Tar Miriel was the Queen and therefore (notionally) in charge of affairs in Numenor, she probably felt that it was her duty to stay in Armenelos even if in her heart she wanted to leave. Her thought was probably; "The Queen does not desert her people."
answered 1 min ago
Jeremy LucasJeremy Lucas
1
New contributor
Jeremy Lucas is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
add a comment |
Remembering that Tar Miriel was the Queen and therefore (notionally) in charge of affairs in Numenor, she probably felt that it was her duty to stay in Armenelos even if in her heart she wanted to leave. Her thought was probably; "The Queen does not desert her people."
answered 1 min ago
Jeremy LucasJeremy Lucas
1
New contributor
Jeremy Lucas is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
add a comment |
Remembering that Tar Miriel was the Queen and therefore (notionally) in charge of affairs in Numenor, she probably felt that it was her duty to stay in Armenelos even if in her heart she wanted to leave. Her thought was probably; "The Queen does not desert her people."
answered 1 min ago
Jeremy LucasJeremy Lucas
1
New contributor
Jeremy Lucas is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
Remembering that Tar Miriel was the Queen and therefore (notionally) in charge of affairs in Numenor, she probably felt that it was her duty to stay in Armenelos even if in her heart she wanted to leave. Her thought was probably; "The Queen does not desert her people."
answered 1 min ago
Jeremy LucasJeremy Lucas
1
New contributor
Jeremy Lucas is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
answered 1 min ago
Jeremy LucasJeremy Lucas
1
New contributor
Jeremy Lucas is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
answered 1 min ago
Jeremy LucasJeremy Lucas
1
answered 1 min ago
Jeremy LucasJeremy Lucas
1
1
New contributor
Jeremy Lucas is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
New contributor
Jeremy Lucas is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
Jeremy Lucas is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
add a comment |
add a comment |
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The Kingsmen probably stopped her from leaving since she was the wife of their King.
– user35326
Dec 2 '15 at 20:44