A fish with a [human] face will bring a tsunami. Is this an actual Japanese wives' tale?
In the movie Ponyo when Sōsuke brings the fish he rescued to the nursing home his mom works at and shows it to the old ladies in wheelchairs, the grumpy old lady screams that a fish with a [human] face will bring a tsunami and demands he throws it back into the ocean.
Is this a real Japanese wives' tale, or just a quirk of this movie?
fairy-tales studio-ghibli ponyo
edited 16 hours ago
Stormblessed
2,287733
asked Sep 2 '11 at 2:53
KalamaneKalamane
4,21463572
add a comment |
In the movie Ponyo when Sōsuke brings the fish he rescued to the nursing home his mom works at and shows it to the old ladies in wheelchairs, the grumpy old lady screams that a fish with a [human] face will bring a tsunami and demands he throws it back into the ocean.
Is this a real Japanese wives' tale, or just a quirk of this movie?
fairy-tales studio-ghibli ponyo
edited 16 hours ago
Stormblessed
2,287733
asked Sep 2 '11 at 2:53
KalamaneKalamane
4,21463572
1
There's a Japanese culture site in SE, maybe you could try posting there?
– apoorv020
Sep 2 '11 at 5:43
4
@apoorv020 There isn't a Japanese culture site. There's Japanese Language, but it's specifically about the Japanese language; cultural questions are allowed only inasmuch as they are relevant to learning the language. I've advertised this question on their chat room, always a possibility for questions that are related to the theme of another site.
– user56
Sep 2 '11 at 6:27
I believe there is a legend or myth yes. I remember seeing something on discovery or NatGeo about it (could have been 10 years ago) but I do not remember what exactly it was. I do seem to remember it being about the japanese fishing culture. This was before the recent dolphin/whaling sh**storm so it was at least 5 years ago. I beleive the legend was if you released the fish unharmed all would be fine but if you kept it or it died then it would bring a giant wave to destroy your home. Though it may have been the reverse.
– Chad
Sep 2 '11 at 19:49
add a comment |
In the movie Ponyo when Sōsuke brings the fish he rescued to the nursing home his mom works at and shows it to the old ladies in wheelchairs, the grumpy old lady screams that a fish with a [human] face will bring a tsunami and demands he throws it back into the ocean.
Is this a real Japanese wives' tale, or just a quirk of this movie?
fairy-tales studio-ghibli ponyo
edited 16 hours ago
Stormblessed
2,287733
asked Sep 2 '11 at 2:53
KalamaneKalamane
4,21463572
In the movie Ponyo when Sōsuke brings the fish he rescued to the nursing home his mom works at and shows it to the old ladies in wheelchairs, the grumpy old lady screams that a fish with a [human] face will bring a tsunami and demands he throws it back into the ocean.
Is this a real Japanese wives' tale, or just a quirk of this movie?
fairy-tales studio-ghibli ponyo
fairy-tales studio-ghibli ponyo
edited 16 hours ago
Stormblessed
2,287733
asked Sep 2 '11 at 2:53
KalamaneKalamane
4,21463572
edited 16 hours ago
Stormblessed
2,287733
asked Sep 2 '11 at 2:53
KalamaneKalamane
4,21463572
edited 16 hours ago
Stormblessed
2,287733
edited 16 hours ago
Stormblessed
2,287733
edited 16 hours ago
Stormblessed
2,287733
2,287733
asked Sep 2 '11 at 2:53
KalamaneKalamane
4,21463572
asked Sep 2 '11 at 2:53
KalamaneKalamane
4,21463572
asked Sep 2 '11 at 2:53
KalamaneKalamane
4,21463572
4,21463572
1
There's a Japanese culture site in SE, maybe you could try posting there?
– apoorv020
Sep 2 '11 at 5:43
4
@apoorv020 There isn't a Japanese culture site. There's Japanese Language, but it's specifically about the Japanese language; cultural questions are allowed only inasmuch as they are relevant to learning the language. I've advertised this question on their chat room, always a possibility for questions that are related to the theme of another site.
– user56
Sep 2 '11 at 6:27
I believe there is a legend or myth yes. I remember seeing something on discovery or NatGeo about it (could have been 10 years ago) but I do not remember what exactly it was. I do seem to remember it being about the japanese fishing culture. This was before the recent dolphin/whaling sh**storm so it was at least 5 years ago. I beleive the legend was if you released the fish unharmed all would be fine but if you kept it or it died then it would bring a giant wave to destroy your home. Though it may have been the reverse.
– Chad
Sep 2 '11 at 19:49
add a comment |
1
There's a Japanese culture site in SE, maybe you could try posting there?
– apoorv020
Sep 2 '11 at 5:43
4
@apoorv020 There isn't a Japanese culture site. There's Japanese Language, but it's specifically about the Japanese language; cultural questions are allowed only inasmuch as they are relevant to learning the language. I've advertised this question on their chat room, always a possibility for questions that are related to the theme of another site.
– user56
Sep 2 '11 at 6:27
I believe there is a legend or myth yes. I remember seeing something on discovery or NatGeo about it (could have been 10 years ago) but I do not remember what exactly it was. I do seem to remember it being about the japanese fishing culture. This was before the recent dolphin/whaling sh**storm so it was at least 5 years ago. I beleive the legend was if you released the fish unharmed all would be fine but if you kept it or it died then it would bring a giant wave to destroy your home. Though it may have been the reverse.
– Chad
Sep 2 '11 at 19:49
1
1
There's a Japanese culture site in SE, maybe you could try posting there?
– apoorv020
Sep 2 '11 at 5:43
There's a Japanese culture site in SE, maybe you could try posting there?
– apoorv020
Sep 2 '11 at 5:43
4
4
@apoorv020 There isn't a Japanese culture site. There's Japanese Language, but it's specifically about the Japanese language; cultural questions are allowed only inasmuch as they are relevant to learning the language. I've advertised this question on their chat room, always a possibility for questions that are related to the theme of another site.
– user56
Sep 2 '11 at 6:27
@apoorv020 There isn't a Japanese culture site. There's Japanese Language, but it's specifically about the Japanese language; cultural questions are allowed only inasmuch as they are relevant to learning the language. I've advertised this question on their chat room, always a possibility for questions that are related to the theme of another site.
– user56
Sep 2 '11 at 6:27
I believe there is a legend or myth yes. I remember seeing something on discovery or NatGeo about it (could have been 10 years ago) but I do not remember what exactly it was. I do seem to remember it being about the japanese fishing culture. This was before the recent dolphin/whaling sh**storm so it was at least 5 years ago. I beleive the legend was if you released the fish unharmed all would be fine but if you kept it or it died then it would bring a giant wave to destroy your home. Though it may have been the reverse.
– Chad
Sep 2 '11 at 19:49
I believe there is a legend or myth yes. I remember seeing something on discovery or NatGeo about it (could have been 10 years ago) but I do not remember what exactly it was. I do seem to remember it being about the japanese fishing culture. This was before the recent dolphin/whaling sh**storm so it was at least 5 years ago. I beleive the legend was if you released the fish unharmed all would be fine but if you kept it or it died then it would bring a giant wave to destroy your home. Though it may have been the reverse.
– Chad
Sep 2 '11 at 19:49
add a comment |
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
It's probably a Ningyo.
From the linked Wikipedia article:
Ningyo (人魚, "human fish", often translated as "mermaid") is a fish-like creature from Japanese folklore. Anciently, it was described with a monkey’s mouth with small teeth like a fish’s, shining golden scales, and a quiet voice like a skylark or a flute. Its flesh is pleasant-tasting, and anyone who eats it will attain remarkable longevity. However, catching a ningyo was believed to bring storms and misfortune, so fishermen who caught these creatures were said to throw them back into the sea. A ningyo washed onto the beach was an omen of war or calamity.
edited Jul 4 '12 at 16:02
Gabe Willard
16.5k1289123
answered Jul 4 '12 at 14:15
KatKat
17613
This seems like the best answer.
– Kalamane
Jun 25 '17 at 19:31
add a comment |
There's a mythical creature called a Namazu - a giant catfish.
http://historyofgeology.fieldofscience.com/2011/01/namazu-earthshaker.html
According to Japanese myth the cause of earthquakes is the giant catfish Namazu or Namazu-e (the second term refers to the woodcuts of Namazu) living buried in the underground. Namazu is one of the yo-kai (in a very broad sense translatable as "monster"), creatures of Japanese mythology and folklore that were associated or caused misfortune or disasters. By moving his tail he can shake the entire earth and unfortunately he loves to cause trouble and havoc.
A giant catfish is not the same as a cute little fish with a human face, but this is the closest I can find.
Maybe I missed something on the wikipedia page?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_legendary_creatures_from_Japan
The wikipedia page does have many creatures that appear in Studio Ghibli films.
answered Sep 20 '11 at 10:58
DanBealeDanBeale
1295
add a comment |
Hayao Miyazaki is known for his fairy tale styled movies. They are not actual fairy tales, but they draw many elements from fairy tales. He also takes inspirations from modern fantasy authors.
I don't think there may be a popular folktale about a fish with human face. But there are several creatures in many cultures/gods that have fishes with human face and some of them are quite capable of creating violent storms and other sea disasters. Hayao Miyazaki may have taken inspirations from them. Examples of such creatures/gods are: Mermaids, Sea Nymphs, Water Sprites, Sirens, Dagon (god), Kappa (Japanese water spirit) etc.
Also the Disney DVD page says it is based on The Little Mermaid (may be a selling point).
answered Sep 26 '11 at 19:14
KenSuvyKenSuvy
1,11821024
add a comment |
Your Answer
StackExchange.ready(function() {
var channelOptions = {
tags: "".split(" "),
id: "186"
};
initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);
StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function() {
// Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled) {
StackExchange.using("snippets", function() {
createEditor();
});
}
else {
createEditor();
}
});
function createEditor() {
StackExchange.prepareEditor({
heartbeatType: 'answer',
autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
convertImagesToLinks: false,
noModals: true,
showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
reputationToPostImages: null,
bindNavPrevention: true,
postfix: "",
imageUploader: {
brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
allowUrls: true
},
noCode: true, onDemand: true,
discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
});
}
});
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fscifi.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f5336%2fa-fish-with-a-human-face-will-bring-a-tsunami-is-this-an-actual-japanese-wive%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
It's probably a Ningyo.
From the linked Wikipedia article:
Ningyo (人魚, "human fish", often translated as "mermaid") is a fish-like creature from Japanese folklore. Anciently, it was described with a monkey’s mouth with small teeth like a fish’s, shining golden scales, and a quiet voice like a skylark or a flute. Its flesh is pleasant-tasting, and anyone who eats it will attain remarkable longevity. However, catching a ningyo was believed to bring storms and misfortune, so fishermen who caught these creatures were said to throw them back into the sea. A ningyo washed onto the beach was an omen of war or calamity.
edited Jul 4 '12 at 16:02
Gabe Willard
16.5k1289123
answered Jul 4 '12 at 14:15
KatKat
17613
This seems like the best answer.
– Kalamane
Jun 25 '17 at 19:31
add a comment |
It's probably a Ningyo.
From the linked Wikipedia article:
Ningyo (人魚, "human fish", often translated as "mermaid") is a fish-like creature from Japanese folklore. Anciently, it was described with a monkey’s mouth with small teeth like a fish’s, shining golden scales, and a quiet voice like a skylark or a flute. Its flesh is pleasant-tasting, and anyone who eats it will attain remarkable longevity. However, catching a ningyo was believed to bring storms and misfortune, so fishermen who caught these creatures were said to throw them back into the sea. A ningyo washed onto the beach was an omen of war or calamity.
edited Jul 4 '12 at 16:02
Gabe Willard
16.5k1289123
answered Jul 4 '12 at 14:15
KatKat
17613
This seems like the best answer.
– Kalamane
Jun 25 '17 at 19:31
add a comment |
It's probably a Ningyo.
From the linked Wikipedia article:
Ningyo (人魚, "human fish", often translated as "mermaid") is a fish-like creature from Japanese folklore. Anciently, it was described with a monkey’s mouth with small teeth like a fish’s, shining golden scales, and a quiet voice like a skylark or a flute. Its flesh is pleasant-tasting, and anyone who eats it will attain remarkable longevity. However, catching a ningyo was believed to bring storms and misfortune, so fishermen who caught these creatures were said to throw them back into the sea. A ningyo washed onto the beach was an omen of war or calamity.
edited Jul 4 '12 at 16:02
Gabe Willard
16.5k1289123
answered Jul 4 '12 at 14:15
KatKat
17613
It's probably a Ningyo.
From the linked Wikipedia article:
Ningyo (人魚, "human fish", often translated as "mermaid") is a fish-like creature from Japanese folklore. Anciently, it was described with a monkey’s mouth with small teeth like a fish’s, shining golden scales, and a quiet voice like a skylark or a flute. Its flesh is pleasant-tasting, and anyone who eats it will attain remarkable longevity. However, catching a ningyo was believed to bring storms and misfortune, so fishermen who caught these creatures were said to throw them back into the sea. A ningyo washed onto the beach was an omen of war or calamity.
edited Jul 4 '12 at 16:02
Gabe Willard
16.5k1289123
answered Jul 4 '12 at 14:15
KatKat
17613
edited Jul 4 '12 at 16:02
Gabe Willard
16.5k1289123
edited Jul 4 '12 at 16:02
Gabe Willard
16.5k1289123
edited Jul 4 '12 at 16:02
Gabe Willard
16.5k1289123
16.5k1289123
answered Jul 4 '12 at 14:15
KatKat
17613
answered Jul 4 '12 at 14:15
KatKat
17613
answered Jul 4 '12 at 14:15
KatKat
17613
17613
This seems like the best answer.
– Kalamane
Jun 25 '17 at 19:31
add a comment |
This seems like the best answer.
– Kalamane
Jun 25 '17 at 19:31
This seems like the best answer.
– Kalamane
Jun 25 '17 at 19:31
This seems like the best answer.
– Kalamane
Jun 25 '17 at 19:31
add a comment |
There's a mythical creature called a Namazu - a giant catfish.
http://historyofgeology.fieldofscience.com/2011/01/namazu-earthshaker.html
According to Japanese myth the cause of earthquakes is the giant catfish Namazu or Namazu-e (the second term refers to the woodcuts of Namazu) living buried in the underground. Namazu is one of the yo-kai (in a very broad sense translatable as "monster"), creatures of Japanese mythology and folklore that were associated or caused misfortune or disasters. By moving his tail he can shake the entire earth and unfortunately he loves to cause trouble and havoc.
A giant catfish is not the same as a cute little fish with a human face, but this is the closest I can find.
Maybe I missed something on the wikipedia page?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_legendary_creatures_from_Japan
The wikipedia page does have many creatures that appear in Studio Ghibli films.
answered Sep 20 '11 at 10:58
DanBealeDanBeale
1295
add a comment |
There's a mythical creature called a Namazu - a giant catfish.
http://historyofgeology.fieldofscience.com/2011/01/namazu-earthshaker.html
According to Japanese myth the cause of earthquakes is the giant catfish Namazu or Namazu-e (the second term refers to the woodcuts of Namazu) living buried in the underground. Namazu is one of the yo-kai (in a very broad sense translatable as "monster"), creatures of Japanese mythology and folklore that were associated or caused misfortune or disasters. By moving his tail he can shake the entire earth and unfortunately he loves to cause trouble and havoc.
A giant catfish is not the same as a cute little fish with a human face, but this is the closest I can find.
Maybe I missed something on the wikipedia page?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_legendary_creatures_from_Japan
The wikipedia page does have many creatures that appear in Studio Ghibli films.
answered Sep 20 '11 at 10:58
DanBealeDanBeale
1295
add a comment |
There's a mythical creature called a Namazu - a giant catfish.
http://historyofgeology.fieldofscience.com/2011/01/namazu-earthshaker.html
According to Japanese myth the cause of earthquakes is the giant catfish Namazu or Namazu-e (the second term refers to the woodcuts of Namazu) living buried in the underground. Namazu is one of the yo-kai (in a very broad sense translatable as "monster"), creatures of Japanese mythology and folklore that were associated or caused misfortune or disasters. By moving his tail he can shake the entire earth and unfortunately he loves to cause trouble and havoc.
A giant catfish is not the same as a cute little fish with a human face, but this is the closest I can find.
Maybe I missed something on the wikipedia page?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_legendary_creatures_from_Japan
The wikipedia page does have many creatures that appear in Studio Ghibli films.
answered Sep 20 '11 at 10:58
DanBealeDanBeale
1295
There's a mythical creature called a Namazu - a giant catfish.
http://historyofgeology.fieldofscience.com/2011/01/namazu-earthshaker.html
According to Japanese myth the cause of earthquakes is the giant catfish Namazu or Namazu-e (the second term refers to the woodcuts of Namazu) living buried in the underground. Namazu is one of the yo-kai (in a very broad sense translatable as "monster"), creatures of Japanese mythology and folklore that were associated or caused misfortune or disasters. By moving his tail he can shake the entire earth and unfortunately he loves to cause trouble and havoc.
A giant catfish is not the same as a cute little fish with a human face, but this is the closest I can find.
Maybe I missed something on the wikipedia page?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_legendary_creatures_from_Japan
The wikipedia page does have many creatures that appear in Studio Ghibli films.
answered Sep 20 '11 at 10:58
DanBealeDanBeale
1295
edited Sep 20 '11 at 11:30
answered Sep 20 '11 at 10:58
DanBealeDanBeale
1295
answered Sep 20 '11 at 10:58
DanBealeDanBeale
1295
answered Sep 20 '11 at 10:58
DanBealeDanBeale
1295
1295
add a comment |
add a comment |
Hayao Miyazaki is known for his fairy tale styled movies. They are not actual fairy tales, but they draw many elements from fairy tales. He also takes inspirations from modern fantasy authors.
I don't think there may be a popular folktale about a fish with human face. But there are several creatures in many cultures/gods that have fishes with human face and some of them are quite capable of creating violent storms and other sea disasters. Hayao Miyazaki may have taken inspirations from them. Examples of such creatures/gods are: Mermaids, Sea Nymphs, Water Sprites, Sirens, Dagon (god), Kappa (Japanese water spirit) etc.
Also the Disney DVD page says it is based on The Little Mermaid (may be a selling point).
answered Sep 26 '11 at 19:14
KenSuvyKenSuvy
1,11821024
add a comment |
Hayao Miyazaki is known for his fairy tale styled movies. They are not actual fairy tales, but they draw many elements from fairy tales. He also takes inspirations from modern fantasy authors.
I don't think there may be a popular folktale about a fish with human face. But there are several creatures in many cultures/gods that have fishes with human face and some of them are quite capable of creating violent storms and other sea disasters. Hayao Miyazaki may have taken inspirations from them. Examples of such creatures/gods are: Mermaids, Sea Nymphs, Water Sprites, Sirens, Dagon (god), Kappa (Japanese water spirit) etc.
Also the Disney DVD page says it is based on The Little Mermaid (may be a selling point).
answered Sep 26 '11 at 19:14
KenSuvyKenSuvy
1,11821024
add a comment |
Hayao Miyazaki is known for his fairy tale styled movies. They are not actual fairy tales, but they draw many elements from fairy tales. He also takes inspirations from modern fantasy authors.
I don't think there may be a popular folktale about a fish with human face. But there are several creatures in many cultures/gods that have fishes with human face and some of them are quite capable of creating violent storms and other sea disasters. Hayao Miyazaki may have taken inspirations from them. Examples of such creatures/gods are: Mermaids, Sea Nymphs, Water Sprites, Sirens, Dagon (god), Kappa (Japanese water spirit) etc.
Also the Disney DVD page says it is based on The Little Mermaid (may be a selling point).
answered Sep 26 '11 at 19:14
KenSuvyKenSuvy
1,11821024
Hayao Miyazaki is known for his fairy tale styled movies. They are not actual fairy tales, but they draw many elements from fairy tales. He also takes inspirations from modern fantasy authors.
I don't think there may be a popular folktale about a fish with human face. But there are several creatures in many cultures/gods that have fishes with human face and some of them are quite capable of creating violent storms and other sea disasters. Hayao Miyazaki may have taken inspirations from them. Examples of such creatures/gods are: Mermaids, Sea Nymphs, Water Sprites, Sirens, Dagon (god), Kappa (Japanese water spirit) etc.
Also the Disney DVD page says it is based on The Little Mermaid (may be a selling point).
answered Sep 26 '11 at 19:14
KenSuvyKenSuvy
1,11821024
edited Sep 26 '11 at 19:29
answered Sep 26 '11 at 19:14
KenSuvyKenSuvy
1,11821024
answered Sep 26 '11 at 19:14
KenSuvyKenSuvy
1,11821024
answered Sep 26 '11 at 19:14
KenSuvyKenSuvy
1,11821024
1,11821024
add a comment |
add a comment |
Thanks for contributing an answer to Science Fiction & Fantasy Stack Exchange!
- Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!
But avoid …
- Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.
- Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.
To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fscifi.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f5336%2fa-fish-with-a-human-face-will-bring-a-tsunami-is-this-an-actual-japanese-wive%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
1
There's a Japanese culture site in SE, maybe you could try posting there?
– apoorv020
Sep 2 '11 at 5:43
4
@apoorv020 There isn't a Japanese culture site. There's Japanese Language, but it's specifically about the Japanese language; cultural questions are allowed only inasmuch as they are relevant to learning the language. I've advertised this question on their chat room, always a possibility for questions that are related to the theme of another site.
– user56
Sep 2 '11 at 6:27
I believe there is a legend or myth yes. I remember seeing something on discovery or NatGeo about it (could have been 10 years ago) but I do not remember what exactly it was. I do seem to remember it being about the japanese fishing culture. This was before the recent dolphin/whaling sh**storm so it was at least 5 years ago. I beleive the legend was if you released the fish unharmed all would be fine but if you kept it or it died then it would bring a giant wave to destroy your home. Though it may have been the reverse.
– Chad
Sep 2 '11 at 19:49